U.S. troops can leave 'anytime,' Iraqi P.M. says

[Praxius]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 Which is why you don't just quit since we'll end up having to go back anywy. You get a new commander in chief and finish the job he started and lied us into.

Tell me how many have been replaced since the war began? Has anything improved? From what I see, everything gets worse and worse... If you want to heal a wound, you don't go and stick the knife back in, like putting more troops back into Iraq..... that's like twisting the blade....

They never had a life of democracy..... and trying to put it on them the way it has, has not only given them a bad taste.... but it's destroying them..... let them run their country the way they know how.... that's what they have been asking for....

It's my opinion that the quote was taken out of context. I think the "god willing" part of that indicates that even his attempt at looking somewhat competent in security was marred by serious doubt.

He probably realizes it's gonna suck, but he'll have a better chance of getting everyone to agree and make peace without forign troops occupying the country.

If he shows he's got the power to get you guys out and you give it to him, that might be all that is needed.

[Chaossaber314]

Tell me how many have been replaced since the war began?

Commanders in Chief? Zero.

George W. Bush was the Commander in Chief in 2003. He is currently the Commander in Chief now.

[ZNFYRH]

And has anyone read the follow-up article to this where the Iraqi P.M. states that he was misquoted?

[Praxius]

Quote by: Chaossaber314 Commanders in Chief? Zero. George W. Bush was the Commander in Chief in 2003. He is currently the Commander in Chief now.

My mistake, I was thinking Generals..... Such a foolish term for the president "Comander and Chief" He's the dam president..... why does he require two or three designations?

Who controls what the military does? The President.... there's no need to make him sound like he actually knows what he's doing by calling him Comander and Chief.

That like calling Prime Minister Stephen Harper "Petty Officer and Janitor" or "Big Boss" like in Metal Gear.....

I guess the gold sticker on his scribbler and the title President isn't enough?

Pardon my Canadian Ignorance

[Praxius]

Quote by: ZNFYRH And has anyone read the follow-up article to this where the Iraqi P.M. states that he was misquoted?

Sepaking of which, I haven't come across this article, video, or any other news from anywhere else. That would be something kinda big here in Canada to hear the PM or Iraq to say, and yet, I heard nothing..... I even checked the BBC, and nothing regarding this article seems to exist....

Is this actually true, or is this just something CNN likes to throw out there once in a while?

and as his quote, if true, says:

"We say in full confidence that we are able, God willing, to take the responsibility completely in running the security file if the international forces withdraw at anytime they want," he said.

Last I checked, "Full Confidence" usually doesn't mean "Doubtful" and God Willing is said by everybody over there.... if God permits them to do so, they will complete the job..... in other words, only God may stop their mission..... to me that sounds pretty dam confident.

I've noticed it seems a lot of people from the West really have a bad time with understanding the way they talk and how to interp. translations.

The reason why you all are fearful of leaving Iraq, is because you think as soon as you leave, the insurgents will rush in and kill everyone, as they promised the government that you guys made, will fall.....

Just because they say it's going to fall, doesn't mean they're gonna kill them all or blow them up, etc. as soon as you leave..... what they most likely mean is once you guys leave, both the Prime Minister and the other factions in Iraq will be able to make their own decisions and come to an agreement, and will most likely end with them all agreeing that the current government sucks for them, and they'll change what you guys put in place..... AKA, your government will fall/fail.

But Bush doesn't want that, he wants Oil for all "his hard work", so he's gonna be twisting their words around in translations and make them sound evil and heartless..... and there's gonna be a huge massacare if you pull out..... there's only one Massacare going on right now, and it's due to your occupation.

The sooner you guys get a reality check from what you've been told in the last 6 or so years, the better you'll be and the quicker you'll get out of this..... this is why I compare Bush to Hitler, because he knows how to manipulate the publics fear to do what he wants, and just like Hitler, he now has had a few good years to make this all sink in on you.....

He didn't care about those in the WTC.... that was a part of his plan for more profits and a legacy to impress his daddy and more importantly to give you the public enough evidence and enough fear to believe anything he said..... and everything since has been nothing but BullShat......

And nobody can ever win a war based on lies...... it eventually will come back on you in time.

[Chaossaber314]

Quote by: Praxius Who controls what the military does? The President.... there's no need to make him sound like he actually knows what he's doing by calling him Comander and Chief.

Heh. I thought by saying that we needed an new one, I was making it clear I didn't think he knew what he was doing.

[Praxius]

naw, I was just commenting on the term alone.... lol. He shouldn't be associated with such terms as President of the United States or Chief and Commander...... to me it feels like calling a Chimp Einstein.

But unfortunatly it's reality, and he is..... *shudders*

There hasn't been such a negative outlook on the US in the world's eye in such a long time.... I think what's needed is a complete revamp and removal of the current government to rectitfy something as damaged as that... but that's just me....

[Praxius]

You know, I can somewhat see the future.... the Day Bush looses power, will begin to be an international holiday. We'll all dress up like Rice and Buch like Santa and the Easter Bunny, and we'll hide WOMD eggs around for everyone to find.

[Chaossaber314]

That would suck. We'd never find the eggs!

[Praxius]

lol..... follow the smell in a few months.

[Rainbow]

"We say in full confidence that we are able, God willing, to take the responsibility completely in running the security file if the international forces withdraw at anytime they want," he said.

Since it does not specify a time-frame, it leaves all the options available to U.S.

[Praxius]

Quote by: Rainbow Since it does not specify a time-frame, it leaves all the options available to U.S.

To me, it sounds more like "Thanks for your help and all.... but you're wearing out your welcome.... you don't mind takin off eh? You know.... when you're ready and all.... it would be greatly appreciated."

But the way you worded your comment above.... it almost sounds like you guys get to make the final rulings in everything.... Iraq isn't your country, nor was it ever your country.... They didn't want you guys there in the first place, and they really don't want you there now..... You guys didn't help a dam thing, and you made their way of life far worse then it ever was under Saddam's rule.... and you claim that you guys will take this as "When we're ready to leave we'll leave, when it suits us."

You guys are not the World Police and as soon as you realize this, perhaps less countries would want to see your destruction....

You can't just waltz into a country AKA: Invade.... take out their leader, shove some democratic government they have no clue how to operate in their faces, and say we'll stay until we think things are in our best interests and expect it all to work in two or three years. When the British Empire did this, they prepared for at least a century of ocupation with many more troops then what you guys supplied.... you bit way more off then you can chew in this situation.

You guys seem so worried about a Civil War breaking out and all kinds of people dieing.... isn't that how your country was built? Isn't that how you guys made progress towards Democracy?

Now you guys are trying to pull some short term backwards British Empire trick on them, for the sake of Democracy and freedom, staying in their country until they understand it themselves, and to prevent them from starting a civil war, all the while expecting them to come to a more peaceful solution then what you guys did in the past?

The only reason why you guys are staying in there, is because you all know this democracy will not work, they will change it to what suits them, which most likely be an Islamic State, and if you want them to be Democratic, then isn't it their democratic right to vote and change their government to something not Democratic?

If they don't keep this Democratic government, your government will be afraid that it will show the rest of the Islamic countries that Democracy can and will fail.... in a location that was doomed to fail to begin with. And if Iraq goes back to the way it was, or at least chooses an Islamic style government, then in your eyes, the mission was a failure...... it was doomed to fail from the begining and all those soldiers who have died, have been for nothing..... which is quite sad.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: Praxius To me, it sounds more like "Thanks for your help and all.... but you're wearing out your welcome.... you don't mind takin off eh? You know.... when you're ready and all.... it would be greatly appreciated." But the way you worded your comment above.... it almost sounds like you guys get to make the final rulings in everything.... Iraq isn't your country, nor was it ever your country.... They didn't want you guys there in the first place, and they really don't want you there now..... You guys didn't help a dam thing, and you made their way of life far worse then it ever was under Saddam's rule.... and you claim that you guys will take this as "When we're ready to leave we'll leave, when it suits us." You guys are not the World Police and as soon as you realize this, perhaps less countries would want to see your destruction.... You can't just waltz into a country AKA: Invade.... take out their leader, shove some democratic government they have no clue how to operate in their faces, and say we'll stay until we think things are in our best interests and expect it all to work in two or three years. When the British Empire did this, they prepared for at least a century of ocupation with many more troops then what you guys supplied.... you bit way more off then you can chew in this situation. You guys seem so worried about a Civil War breaking out and all kinds of people dieing.... isn't that how your country was built? Isn't that how you guys made progress towards Democracy? Now you guys are trying to pull some short term backwards British Empire trick on them, for the sake of Democracy and freedom, staying in their country until they understand it themselves, and to prevent them from starting a civil war, all the while expecting them to come to a more peaceful solution then what you guys did in the past? The only reason why you guys are staying in there, is because you all know this democracy will not work, they will change it to what suits them, which most likely be an Islamic State, and if you want them to be Democratic, then isn't it their democratic right to vote and change their government to something not Democratic? If they don't keep this Democratic government, your government will be afraid that it will show the rest of the Islamic countries that Democracy can and will fail.... in a location that was doomed to fail to begin with. And if Iraq goes back to the way it was, or at least chooses an Islamic style government, then in your eyes, the mission was a failure...... it was doomed to fail from the begining and all those soldiers who have died, have been for nothing..... which is quite sad.

#1
You are entitled to your own opinion, always. That is the sense of freedom of speech, expression, etc.

#2, #3, #4, #5, #6
I sense you want to express some of your thoughts.

#7, #8
Here it is a partial and/or full list of those Who care for so-called democracy :
- kids in kindergarten
- some idealism-inspired individuals
- politicians, for several reasons like : to be re-elected and/or force some concepts to be approved and/or accepted, etc.
Democracy is the "Ideological Altar" that serves as a fundament for every single state that has choosen to "practice" that form of political system.

U.S. wants to establish pro-Western Iraqi government. It would ensure that Middle-East region is stabilized, what prompts steady and safe oil supplies. That is quite all about Iraq (not to mention other issues like : intelligence, military bases, economy, marketing, etc.).

Who cares whether Iraq is Islamic and/or non-Islamic state ? Maybe you.
The most important factor is : pro-Western

[Praxius]

Quote by: Rainbow #1 You are entitled to your own opinion, always. That is the sense of freedom of speech, expression, etc.

At this time, that's all it is :)

#2, #3, #4, #5, #6 I sense you want to express some of your thoughts.

Everybody does :)

#7, #8 Here it is a partial and/or full list of those Who care for so-called democracy : - kids in kindergarten

Funny, I didn't even know what democracy was when I was in grade 7.... these kindergarten kids these days sure are smart to know what Democracy is compared to another government method.

- some idealism-inspired individuals - politicians, for several reasons like : to be re-elected and/or force some concepts to be approved and/or accepted, etc.

Cuz that's really important for the collective of society.... to pump the egos up of some poloticians.... lol.

Democracy is the "Ideological Altar" that serves as a fundament for every single state that has choosen to "practice" that form of political system. U.S. wants to establish pro-Western Iraqi government. It would ensure that Middle-East region is stabilized, what prompts steady and safe oil supplies. That is quite all about Iraq (not to mention other issues like : intelligence, military bases, economy, marketing, etc.).

I agree... I enjoy democracy (a certain kind of democracy that is) and I believe in democracy.... because I have been born and raised in a Democratic society.... that doesn't mean that you can expect these people to turn 180 degrees of understanding of life in just a couple of years, nor can you expect that they will actually want it.

Other forms of government, besides Democracy still have certain freedoms, they just concentrate on different freedoms and restrictions then democracy does..... that doesn't make democracy any better or worse in the world..... if Democracy was so great, everybody would be jumping to have a democratic country.

Who cares whether Iraq is Islamic and/or non-Islamic state ? Maybe you. The most important factor is : pro-Western

The easiest manner to get them to be pro-western, is to let them decide the course of their own country's history..... proving that you will let them do what they want in their lives, in their own country, regardless if they switch to an islamic state or not.... would prove to them that you believe in the principles that you use.... they might actually have some respect for democracy if it wasn't forced on them in the first place.

Do you think these Islamic countries actually like some forign country shoving something in their face "For their own good?" ~ Since when did this ever work before?

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: Praxius You know, I can somewhat see the future.... the Day Bush looses power, will begin to be an international holiday.

Wow, I really like that idea.


I bet if people started talking about it now it could actually happen by that fateful day.


That would send a message that just couldn't be overlooked.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: Praxius The easiest manner to get them to be pro-western, is to let them decide the course of their own country's history..... proving that you will let them do what they want in their lives, in their own country, regardless if they switch to an islamic state or not.... would prove to them that you believe in the principles that you use.... they might actually have some respect for democracy if it wasn't forced on them in the first place. Do you think these Islamic countries actually like some forign country shoving something in their face "For their own good?" ~ Since when did this ever work before?

I think Iraqis want to create its state wihout any influence. They have all the rights to go for that.
The key issue : are they going to establish pro-Western and/or "friendly-to-U.S." state, within its political fundaments ? I think it may take some decades till U.S. has a fully functional relationship with Iraq at a standarized level - 2 decades, at least.
Having Turkish-alike state within the Middle-East would boost U.S. presence in that region, with future influence on other Islamic states as well.

P.S.
Kids are smart, especially starting with kindergarten :-)
They know all these days :-)