FBI: Workers saw prisoner abuse at Guantanamo

[bishop]

FBI: Workers saw prisoner abuse at Guantanamo - CNN.com

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The FBI on Tuesday released documents showing at least 26 of the agency's employees witnessed aggressive mistreatment and harsh interrogation techniques of prisoners by other government agencies or outside contractors at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. "On several occasions witnesses saw detainees in interrogation rooms chained hand and foot in fetal position to floor with no chair/food/water; most urinated or defecated on selves and were left there 18, 24 hours or more," according to one FBI account made public. One FBI witness saw a detainee "shaking with cold," while another noted a detainee in a sweltering unventilated room was "almost unconscious on a floor with a pile of hair next to him (he had apparently been pulling it out through the night)." Another witness saw a detainee "with a full beard whose head was wrapped in duct tape." One FBI statement said that an interrogator squatted over the Quran and that a German shepherd dog was ordered to "growl, bark and show his teeth to the prisoner." Another detainee was draped in an Israeli flag. The FBI surveyed all 493 FBI personnel who had been assigned to the military prison facility in the aftermath of the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks and determined no FBI agent or support personnel had participated in any of the controversial practices. "This thorough internal assessment shows the FBI was not involved in these activities in any way," said chief FBI spokesman Richard Kolko. The FBI Office of General Counsel in September 2004 ordered the "special inquiry" into any FBI participation or observations of a series of alleged incidents at the prison camp for suspected terrorists and al Qaeda sympathizers, but the results were not made public. The FBI released the documents in response to a Freedom of Information request by the American Civil Liberties Union, but stressed that most of the findings had already been reported elsewhere. "Note these documents have been vetted by both DoD [Department of Defense] and FBI, and that FBI believes this or substantially similar information has already been released in this litigation," the FBI said. Results of the 26 "positive responses" and several more "not purely negative responses" reported by FBI personnel in the internal inquiry were made available Tuesday on the Web site at Federal Bureau of Investigation - Home Page. (Read the report) Other actions FBI personnel reported either witnessing or being told about included: Placing a detainee in a darkened cell with the intent of interrogating him for 24 hours straight; the witness reported being told that then-Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld had approved this technique. Keeping detainees awake for days on end with strobe lights and loud music. Dressing as a priest and "baptizing" a detainee. Subjecting a detainee to a lap dance by a topless female guard. Interrupting detainees' attempts to pray by putting fluid on their faces and telling them it was menstrual blood. Beating a detainee who said he had recently undergone abdominal surgery.

completely despicable... another reason to be ashamed of the crimes our country has committed under bush's reign.

[Osborn F Enready]

Another reason to start rebuilding the system from its CONSTITUTIONALLY LIMITED BASE.

[GHook93]

Quote by: bishop FBI: Workers saw prisoner abuse at Guantanamo - CNN.com completely despicable... another reason to be ashamed of the crimes our country has committed under bush's reign.

Poor ultra-liberals! This is the exact thinking why we are losing the war on terror.

[Praxius]

Psssh.... Just more evidence of what I already knew...... a border-line US Concentration Camp...... the only thing missing is the constant manual labor and random executions.

I have respect for the people of the US, but the global community judges your country as a whole, based on what your government, military do and the response by the US people to the actions in question.

Now before I get a bunch of guys flaming me and talking about "They're terrorists!" and "They should be so lucky" or "Let's see how you feel when your country is attacked" etc..... I've already heard it all before, and it doesn't excuse your military's actions.

I'm not here to point the finger and vent my anger at anyone in particular here, but heeding a warning that unless the US society/civilians stop pointing the blame on your government and military ran by the government, and making it seem you have no control over it, the so-called "Terrorists" will continue to attack civilians and your country, because they see it as Democracy being run by the people.

If you affect the public, you affect the government, and whereby the US and even the Canadian government claim to be Democratic in the general sense, they are not democratic at all...... but communism with democratic illusions.... ie: you only get to vote on things that really don't matter in the big spectrum, while each political party you vote in, ends up being the same as the last ones, until you are at the point where you gotta vote in the lesser of two evils.

The people of the US and when the time comes, the people of Canada, both have to stand up to our governments and revamp the whole system into a true Democracy.... which the closest would be Direct Democracy, which can be accomplished with todays technology.

Direct democracy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Soon enough, I'll post a thread with my own government guidelines I came up with a few years back that not only implements a Direct Democracy government, but also abolishes the need for currency......

and before anybody starts saying "well without money, you're just talking about Communism..." ~ Remember that Communism was also based on currency, but the currency was run by and through the government, where the common citizen never really delt with it.

By all means, correct me if I am wrong.

[Praxius]

Quote by: GHook93 Poor ultra-liberals! This is the exact thinking why we are losing the war on terror.

Oh yeah..... and "Stay the Course" was working so well too.... :rolleyes:

How's that "War on Drugs" going by the way? Winning yet??

Kinda hard to win a war on something that can't be easily generalized.

[RickSp]

Quote by: GHook93 Poor ultra-liberals! This is the exact thinking why we are losing the war on terror.

Sure. Act like barbarians, thats the way to win! But wait, we are losing in Iraq.

Now GHook says "liberal thinking" is why we are losing. Never realized thinking was such threat to our security. Might explain why so little of it is evident among Bush supporters.

[The Sexorcist]

What a surprise! We use the lack of human rights in third-world areas to perform illegal activities for the idea of "national interests" (i.e. goals and activities that are less-than-admirable). Guateamala? El Salvador? Panama?

I can't believe it when people try to play off Gitmo like it's a legit prison. The International Socialist Review has been covering the lack of human rights and dignified treatment every issue; it's deplorable and it's a national embarassment.

For action:
Close Guantanamo 2006 Denounce Torture Initiative

[bishop]

Quote by: GHook93 Poor ultra-liberals! This is the exact thinking why we are losing the war on terror.

what a load.... being against the use of torture is HARDLY an "ultra-liberal" position.. imo, presuming that those opposed to the use of torture are "ultra-liberal" is about as dumb as it gets.

i guess mccain is an ultra-liberal by your "logic", right? (in case you weren't aware, mccain also opposes the use of torture.)

[GHook93]

Quote by: Praxius Oh yeah..... and "Stay the Course" was working so well too.... :rolleyes: How's that "War on Drugs" going by the way? Winning yet?? Kinda hard to win a war on something that can't be easily generalized.

LOL, just because I don't cry for "poor" treatment of Islamic terrorist, who cut the heads off of the soldiers and civilians they capture, you are going to say I am for the war, Bush and the War on Drugs.

I have written in countless other threads against Bush, against stay the course and I am HIGHLY (no pun intended) against he war on drugs.

[RickSp]

Quote by: GHook93 LOL, just because I don't cry for "poor" treatment of Islamic terrorist, who cut the heads off of the soldiers and civilians they capture, you are going to say I am for the war, Bush and the War on Drugs. I have written in countless other threads against Bush, against stay the course and I am HIGHLY (no pun intended) against he war on drugs.

So you only support kidnapping, brutality, torture, and murder. OK, thanks for the clarification.

[GHook93]

Quote by: RickSp Sure. Act like barbarians, thats the way to win! But wait, we are losing in Iraq. Now GHook says "liberal thinking" is why we are losing. Never realized thinking was such threat to our security. Might explain why so little of it is evident among Bush supporters.

I read what is happening. Many of the terrorist in Guantanamo Bay have valuable information. How do you expect to get it, asking nicely. The torture is tame when considered what is going on in other countries. Best illustation of this was in "Sleeper Cell." Great show. Farcik, a head terrorist is captivity is tortured American style. It did nothing. Not until he was sent to Saudia Arbia was he ready to talk.

I am not talking about the war in Iraq. The "Liberal thinking" has nothing to do with that train wreck. Its a mistake. Bush skiped his history classes on Vietnam.

What I am talking about is the WAR, and yes its a war on Islamic Fundementals. How the liberal forget 9/11 so quickly. Many Liberals still blindly believe the US government is responsible for 9/11.

[GHook93]

Quote by: bishop what a load.... being against the use of torture is HARDLY an "ultra-liberal" position.. imo, presuming that those opposed to the use of torture are "ultra-liberal" is about as dumb as it gets. i guess mccain is an ultra-liberal by your "logic", right? (in case you weren't aware, mccain also opposes the use of torture.)

No I was suggesting you are an ultra-liberal masking himself as a moderate.

Staying that some degree (and honetly this is a lower degree of torture) is needed in times of war, meaning the war on Islamic Terrorist not Iraq.

[Praxius]

Quote by: GHook93 LOL, just because I don't cry for "poor" treatment of Islamic terrorist, who cut the heads off of the soldiers and civilians they capture.....

Fair enough on your Bush stance.....

But the above?

You're generalizing all the people that are in these prisons as being guilty...... guilty until proven innocent. We here in Canada already have two citizens who were deported from the US into other countries based on information that claims they are terrorists

CTV.ca | RCMP spent $5 million on Arar affair: report

and

Foreign Affairs more hindrance than help when Almaki in prison

Both who are innocent were held and tortured in other countries, via the US government. Canada had a part in some of the mixup as well, by sending the US incorrect information from the RCMP. Canada might have screwed up on their information, but it was the US officials who sent them off to be tortured.

This is the problem.... you have people being detained and treated like animals, when there is a very good chance many are innocent.

Treating the inmates the way they have been reported is no excuse and only makes you as bad as those you are trying to fight.

[Praxius]

The above links to the two cases of Canadian Citizens who were tortured until they made a false confession is a perfect example showing that torture isn't a perfect method of extracting information...... all you'll get is what you want to hear.

[bishop]

Quote by: GHook93 No I was suggesting you are an ultra-liberal masking himself as a moderate. Staying that some degree (and honetly this is a lower degree of torture) is needed in times of war, meaning the war on Islamic Terrorist not Iraq.

well, laughable try, but i am hardly an "ultra-liberal"... is this some pathetic attempt at name-calling or something?

[brien]

Perhaps Americans should be outraged about prisoner abuse here in the US as well. We get all worked up over situations like this, and forget that worse happens everyday in in domestic prisons. Where is the outrage over domestic prisoner abuse?

[RickSp]

Quote by: GHook93 What I am talking about is the WAR, and yes its a war on Islamic Fundementals. How the liberal forget 9/11 so quickly. Many Liberals still blindly believe the US government is responsible for 9/11.

I can not express how annoyed I get when I hear a conservative standing on his damned soapbox lecturing me about "forgetting 9/11." I live in what was once the shadow of the World Trade Towers. My wife was in the mezzanine of WTC1 when the first plane hit. I saw the second plane hit the South tower. I saw the bodies fall. I had to explain to my kids what happened as I took them out of school directly across the river from the billowing inferno.

So when some jumped up supporter of torture tells me that I have forgotten 9/11, I get seriously annoyed. Likewise I am angered by a president who would rather trash the Constitution than go after terrorists. A president who lies us into a war and lets the biggest terrorists escape.

And spare me your malarkey that " many Liberals still blindly believe the US government is responsible for 9/11". Not only isn't it true, but it is just another self-serving lie.

You apparently have no regard for basic human rights and must be so frightened by the "Islamic Fundementals", whomever they may be, cowering before the fearmongers, that you are willing to see the Constitution reduced to a meaningless scrap of paper. Looks like rank cowardice to me.

[rmnunez]

Rick, when you remember 911, why do you think that happened? Do you tell your kids it was because 'Dubya' is some semi-simian ethnophobic unilateralist plutocratic born-again crusader seeking to outdo his poorly performing dad?

Islamic fundamentalism is a genuine threat, not just to united statians, but evidently so to Britons, Spaniards, Balinese, Pakistanis, Saudis and countless other citizens of different countries slaughtered by enraged jihadee would-be martyrs fired up by recognized members of the Muslim clergy. Islamic fundamentalism, despite any ambiguities in the concept, is a shared element among Al Qaeders and other associated terrorist groups in Palestine, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Morocco, Somalia and elsewhere.

The "demands" read into OBL rants and claims of "responsibility" refering to changes in US foreign policy (and profusely sprinkled with Islamic religious references) make clear Islamic fundamentalism does have a lot to do with terrorism. Muslim clerics preach a holy war they call jihad against all infidels. These clerics rally their faithful to annihilate infidels, first and foremost the united statians, followed closely by Euers and assorted other westerners. Their advocacy calls for suicidal fanaticism in what some believe is an effort to restore an idealized modern caliphate.

[ByaKya]

Quote by: rmnunez Rick, when you remember 911, why do you think that happened? Do you tell your kids it was because 'Dubya' is some semi-simian ethnophobic unilateralist plutocratic born-again crusader seeking to outdo his poorly performing dad? Islamic fundamentalism is a genuine threat, not just to united statians, but evidently so to Britons, Spaniards, Balinese, Pakistanis, Saudis and countless other citizens of different countries slaughtered by enraged jihadee would-be martyrs fired up by recognized members of the Muslim clergy. Islamic fundamentalism, despite any ambiguities in the concept, is a shared element among Al Qaeders and other associated terrorist groups in Palestine, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Morocco, Somalia and elsewhere. The "demands" read into OBL rants and claims of "responsibility" refering to changes in US foreign policy (and profusely sprinkled with Islamic religious references) make clear Islamic fundamentalism does have a lot to do with terrorism. Muslim clerics preach a holy war they call jihad against all infidels. These clerics rally their faithful to annihilate infidels, first and foremost the united statians, followed closely by Euers and assorted other westerners. Their advocacy calls for suicidal fanaticism in what some believe is an effort to restore an idealized modern caliphate.

Im going to hold off on answering, because i know rick is going to rip you a new one.. oh thisll be good

[RickSp]

rmnunez,

Try reading my posts before responding to them. If you had you would see that I do not blame Bush for the 9/11 attacks. I blame Bush for not vigorously pursuing Bin Laden and his gang. I also blame Bush for starting a needless war that has resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands and has only aided Bin Laden and the jihadis.

I guess you missed the thread topic? The FBI reports of abuse of prisoners, prisoners who have never been charged with a crime, held indefinitely in violation of international law and the United States Constitution. Does that ring a bell, perhaps?

Sure Islamic fundamentalism is a threat but so are those who would tear down the entire structure of American jurisprudence in the name of national security. The cowards and thugs who would trash the Constitution in the name of fighting a relatively small group of international criminals deserve only contempt. They are as great threat to American liberty and security as the jihadis that they have only half-heartedly pursued.