Warren Buffett gives away his fortune

[RickSp]

Boetie if you would bother to look at what the Gates Foundation has been doing with the billions it gives away, you would be able to answer for yourself how they have been helping kids in "Shitshack, Iowa and Crapsville, Oklahoma" as you so condescendingly put it. Then again information might contaminate your contempt which you so seem to enjoy.

Guided by the belief that every life has equal value, the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation works to reduce inequities and improve lives around the world. In developing countries, it focuses on improving health, reducing extreme poverty, and increasing access to technology in public libraries. In the United States, the foundation seeks to ensure that all people have access to a great education and to technology in public libraries. In its local region, it focuses on improving the lives of low-income families. Illustrative Grant Commitments United Negro College Fund, Gates Millennium Scholars Program - $1 billion The GAVI Alliance - $1.5 billion Malaria Vaccine Initiative - $258 million Save the Children, Saving Newborn Lives - $110 million United Way of King County, Seattle, WA, - $55 million Knowledgeworks Foundation - $20 million National Council of Culture & Arts, Mexico Library Project - $11.7 million Public Access Computing Hardware Upgrade Program, Multiple library systems - $5.3 million

Foundation Fact Sheet



Blaming the budget decifit on the "estate tax" is also ridiculous, though not unexpected.

[bishop]

those examples don't count either rick.. no example matters in boetie's eyes apparently.

there is no merit to his "argument", but he continues to repeat it... it's comical to say the least.

[Boetie]

RickSp and bishop,

If Capitol Hill had debated the inheritance tax 6 months ago and the dymanic duo announced their charity today, I would go along with your claim that there is no coincidence between the two events. But given that the two events actually took place at the same period, I find it a convenince that it did.

bishop,

The only reason you even knew of the charity is via the news. I read about it in my local paper for three goddam days and not one, not one single article about the inheritance tax being debated at Captiol Hill. And the paper I read is a pro Republican Party, Conservative, Bush Jr loving paper. Not one fucking article on the inheritance tax debate. Not one mention on the news. All of it was from the web and the web only. Here is a link to a website with the news of the inheritance tax and following that link is a snippet from the site


Inheritance tax

In the weeks after the late August 2005 disaster, legislators deemed the 'death tax' on million-dollar estates too great a contrast with the protracted suffering of the disproportionately poor people struggling in the flooded city on the Mississippi River. The memories of Katrina are fading, and the Senate this week made another attempt to pass a law for which the families of 18 billionaires have lobbied intensively for years, according to media reports. The measure won a majority Thursday in the Senate, 57-41, but fell short of the 60 votes needed to end debate, effectively killing the legislation. At stake was 778 billion dollars over 10 years that the federal government is estimated to collect in estate taxes. Only around 0.5 per cent of Americans have net worths large enough for their estates to be assessed after they die.

778 billion dollars choked off from Uncle Sam's wallet. If that amount had been choked off this would increase the deficit significantly inspite of what RickSp says, given that fact that RickSP never provides links to his BS.

Your bogus claim that I'm against Gates and Warren's charity is just a diversionary tactic of yours. Both of you failed and I mean the two of you failed to grasp my original post, which is the convenient timing of the two events and how one drowns out the other.

Now it's time to put up or shut up. Prove to everyone here that the inheritance debate got as much air time ie Fox, CNN and newspaper time ie any major newspaper as Gates and Buffets Public Relation shtick.

I understand that the two of you will continue to play blind stupid and dumb. I went through this before with the two of you. The fact is, it was all to cozy to have all the media on two billionaires and little mention of Capitol Hill trying to do the bidding of billionaires as the expense of the Average American.

[bishop]

so, this is a debate over the media, not about the charity or the contribution to that charity?

[Boetie]

bishop posts: so, this is a debate over the media, not about the charity or the contribution to that charity?

Yes, you have hit the nail on the head. I applaud Gates and Buffetts generosity. For you to state the above I apologize for any insult I hurled at you.

[RickSp]

More insults and lies. Typical Boetie. At least you grudgingly admit Gates and Buffett's generosity. That is some progress anyway.

And you are right Bishop, "no example matters in boetie's eyes apparently". You nailed that one.

[Mia]

...

[Mia]

Quote by: Marilyn Monroe From what I've read here and there Buffett hasn't always been a philanthropist. Give it to the government, and let them spend it where it is needed. Plus, charity does begin at home, yet they send a lot of the money to other countries.

From what I read about how the money is distributed, it looks like much of it is filling holes that government isn't funding.

[Boetie]

Gee RickSp and I supposed you're going to come back and razzle dazzle us all with your incontrovertable proof that the inheritance tax debate at Capitol Hill got as much air play and newspaper coverage as the Gates and Buffett coverage.

I'm sure everyone here at voloconvo is just holding their breaths that there will be links in abundance from you showing how not taking in 778 billion dollars in taxes over the next ten years won't even be a burden on the Average American.

I'm sure you will oooo and awww everyone about how cutting food from children is every bit as compassionate as sucking up to 18 billionaire families with their demand that the estate tax be repealed.

You go RickSP, we are all awaiting for your brilliancy to shine. Please don't try to blind us.

[bishop]

Quote by: Boetie bishop posts: so, this is a debate over the media, not about the charity or the contribution to that charity? Yes, you have hit the nail on the head. I applaud Gates and Buffetts generosity. For you to state the above I apologize for any insult I hurled at you.

well, when you choose to derail topics could you at least tell us in advance so we aren't confused? usually, i assume that people ARE posting on-topic..

i'd comment on the deficit, but that has nothing to do with this thread..

[Boetie]

bishop posts: well, when you choose to derail topics could you at least tell us in advance so we aren't confused? usually, i assume that people ARE posting on-topic.

The title of the thread is "Warren Buffett gives away his fortune" a thread you started. The only comment you made at the very start is this:

another billionaire with a good conscience.. how rare these people are

That's all you said. What the hell is there to debate from that statement of yours? This is a debate forum, not a suck up forum.

From my very first post on this thread I posted this:

Did the hungry kids get the attention? No! just a couple of rich men and all the sucks ups going ooo and awww over their pr stunt.

Given the whole of my first post it is clear that I was reffering to the media not giving any attention to the inheritance tax debate or to the hungry children. So tell us brainiac how do you debate your original statement again which is this:

another billionaire with a good conscience.. how rare these people are

That as I said before is a suck up comment but did you notice this statement from a link I provided in one of my post:

and the Senate this week made another attempt to pass a law for which the families of 18 billionaires have lobbied intensively for years, according to media reports.

Not much news coverage on that little bit of information is there? Oh hell fucking no, not a peep. So your version of staying on topic would be like this:

What a credit to our class Gates and Buffett is, why we need to throw a party, we need to celebrate the majesty they have shown, we need to praise and sing of their qualities.

For that I'm sure you'll say I'm on topic. Give us all a break.

[RickSp]

Boetie, the bullshit just gets boring.

You start out by claiming that Buffett and Gates are in some sort of conspiracy to support the repeal of the inheritance tax. You call a 30 billion dollar donation to help support education and fight childhood diseases a pr stunt and when we call you on it you fall back on your typical insults and slurs. Your statements are irresponsilbe, uniformed and merely idiotic.

And no doubt you will respond with another round of purile invective. But then what else is new?

[bishop]

not all comments in "breaking news" qualify for debatable thread of the year.. that doesn't mean that you are free to break the rules:

Quote by: the rules Respect other opinions: If a topic does not interest you just avoid it and post in another topic. Contributing to a topic to dismiss the very discussion of it will not be tolerated.

[Chris]

Boetie,

You have gotten out of order in this topic. Consider this an initial warning. You could also quit being disrespectful to others.

Reply via PM only and not in this thread

[Marilyn Monroe]

Quote by: Mia From what I read about how the money is distributed, it looks like much of it is filling holes that government isn't funding.

My suspicion is that these guys are both pro-government, but yet they give their money as THEY please, not necessarily where it's needed most.

I say give it to job-training programs, and for poor healthcare. They do give away in many areas, and I did look it up, but a lot goes to their personal "pet" type projects, not where it is most needed necessarily.

I said it's a nice gesture, and no matter where they spend it it is doing good, but still if you are pro-social spending then show it.

Also, this has to be a huge tax break for them.

This is a debate forum, so all the various avenues should be mentioned, not just the complimentary avenues.

[RickSp]

Quote by: Marilyn Monroe My suspicion is that these guys are both pro-government, but yet they give their money as THEY please, not necessarily where it's needed most. I say give it to job-training programs, and for poor healthcare. They do give away in many areas, and I did look it up, but a lot goes to their personal "pet" type projects, not where it is most needed necessarily. I said it's a nice gesture, and no matter where they spend it it is doing good, but still if you are pro-social spending then show it. Also, this has to be a huge tax break for them. This is a debate forum, so all the various avenues should be mentioned, not just the complimentary avenues.

Do you have any evidence for your "suspicions"? Who is to decide where the funds are "most needed". Shouldn't they have the right to donate the money where they see fit? It is their money after all. Please explain how giving away 85% of his wealth is a huge tax break for Buffett in terms of money that he actually gets to keep.

[Nono]

Quote by: bishop when you talk about what foreign governments donate in raw numerical terms to non-domestic causes, the amounts aren't particularly noteworthy

What's noteworthy, and endlessly breathtaking, is the econo-religious dogma that private is somehow more efficient and effective than public.

[bishop]

well, prove your case then... i cited lots of examples proving my case in post #65 (in addition to the information rick posted)..

all you've offered are offhand snippy statements without ANY supportive facts.. i can simply agree to disagree if you don't feel like supporting your argument of course.

[Nono]

1) One can't "prove" anything in this realm. That kind of language reminds me of a lot of Marxists I've talked to, who constitute another example of utopian True Believers.

2) You say you cited "lots of" examples, but what you really did was post a lot of stuff praising private charities (big deal -- I praise 'em too, and give money to them: the acid test) and saying that this or that vital activity isn't receiving enough attention/money (something I also could have told you).

Then, with consumate lack of any species of scientific rigour, you make the flip satement that "government (...) does a poor job" of saving lives. Sounds like an extract from a market-fundamentalist rosary.

Yes, we can agree to disagree. Certainly neither can "prove" the other wrong.
I know (or assume) that you study at one of the high temples of Market Worship. But you really should ask yourself what sort of mental box you maybe aren't thinking outside of.

[bishop]

forget prove.. you aren't even attempting to support your argument. posting your snide assed retorts without any information on your part.. forgive me for not being impressed with your lazy debating style - but thanks for the unnecessary insults at least. that was good of you.

http://www.acton.org/ppolicy/comment/article.php?id=238

Each year individual Americans donate around $35 billion overseas—a base estimate—which is more than three and a half times what the U.S. government contributes, according to Carol Adelman, senior fellow at the Hudson Institute and specialist in international aid and health issues. As a snapshot, in 2000, the U.S. Agency for International Development reported $56 billion donated to developing countries, sixty percent coming from private giving. Most developed countries in Europe lag far behind the United States when it comes to charitable giving by individuals. Philanthropy Magazine reported a German study that found the average American contributing around seven times what the average German contributes.

so, american citizens donate roughly 3.5 times as much as our government, whose donations to international aid groups dwarf the contributions made from all other individual countries.. not only do europeans contribute less by substantial amounts, but so too do their governments. but i know... that's just more of my tired ol' prayers from the high temple of market worship.. :rolleyes: