NSA building massive database of phone records

[Sean]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/05/....ap/index.html

Congressional Democrats demanded answers from the Bush administration Thursday about a report that the government secretly collected records of ordinary Americans' phone calls to build a database of every call made within the country. "It is our government, it's not one party's government. It's America's government. Those entrusted with great power have a duty to answer to Americans what they are doing," said Sen. Patrick Leahy of Vermont, the ranking Democrat on the Senate Judiciary Committee. AT&T, Verizon and BellSouth telephone companies began turning over records of tens of millions of their customers' phone calls to the National Security Agency program shortly after the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, USA Today reported, citing anonymous sources it said had direct knowledge of the arrangement. The telephone companies on Thursday declined to comment on national security matters, and would say only that they are assisting government agencies in accordance with the law. "We have been in full compliance with the law and we are committed to our customers' privacy," said Bob Varettoni, a spokesman for Verizon. The White House defended its overall eavesdropping program and said no domestic surveillance is conducted without court approval. "The intelligence activities undertaken by the United States government are lawful, necessary and required to protect Americans from terrorist attacks," said Dana Perino, the deputy White House press secretary, who added that appropriate members of Congress have been briefed on intelligence activities. On Capitol Hill, Sen. Arlen Specter, R-Pennsylvania, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said he would call the phone companies to appear before the panel "to find out exactly what is going on."

[brien]

Quote by: Sean http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/05/....ap/index.html

More off Huxley's 1984. It gets worse with every year. I fully expect they have a national database on every American who has a Social Security card and pays taxes.

[bishop]

and eventually microchips will be implanted into every newborn baby...

this database... i wonder how involved hayden was in its creation.. interesting that this bit of news was just discovered by the media now, conveniently coinciding with hayden's nomination.

[tman_ndsu08]

Oh no! My phone records!

A lot of fun they'll have reading those.

[Autolykos]

Quote by: brien More off Huxley's 1984. It gets worse with every year. I fully expect they have a national database on every American who has a Social Security card and pays taxes.

I think you mean Orwell here. Huxley wrote Brave New World.

- Rob

[tman_ndsu08]

I don't care if they have my records, I have nothing to hide.

Just sucks that I'm paying for them to read them.

[phoenix_fire]

PF's most frequently called numbers:

Mom
Pastor
Little sister
Best friend
Friend
Friend
Guy Friend (totally platonic)
Work

There. Now everyone knows. I have nothing to hide, but then again, that doesn't give the fed an open invitation to go browsing through my records. I don't have anything illegal in my apartment, but I don't want them going through that either.

My basic theory about government spying is that they do whatever the heck they want and are pretty good at not getting caught. Except for instances like these.

I am not looking forward to the chip either, but it's coming. They're not putting one in my kids (should I ever have any), though.

[RickSp]

So you don't mind that the NSA knows who you call and when? They might be listening in or not - you'll never know. You have nothing to hide? Do you really want the govenment making up their own minds about whther that is true or not? And all you care about is the cost? Scary. Folks like you make it way too easy for the supporters of the police state.

It appears that to the Bush administration and its supporters, the Constitution and specifically the Bill of Rights is a threat to our security. I guess Bush thinks that our freedom only helps the "evil doers".

[tman_ndsu08]

Rick,

I have nothing to hide. They can look all they want.


If other people don't like that, then they should fight it if they want. I won't be joining them.

That's all.

[Osborn F Enready]

And people thought I was crazy when I said revolt is long overdue..... LOL

[bishop]

the thing i don't like and don't understand is how the government can evey contruct such a database without having explicit congressional approval beforehand.. my guess is that bush applied his typical broad (as far as the eye can see) interpretation of powers wrongly given to him by congress.

once they build these things, they don't shut them off. so, it seems that they can do whatever they want.

[brien]

Quote by: RickSp So you don't mind that the NSA knows who you call and when? They might be listening in or not - you'll never know. You have nothing to hide? Do you really want the govenment making up their own minds about whther that is true or not? And all you care about is the cost? Scary. Folks like you make it way too easy for the supporters of the police state. It appears that to the Bush administration and its supporters, the Constitution and specifically the Bill of Rights is a threat to our security. I guess Bush thinks that our freedom only helps the "evil doers".

Rick: I am with you on this one. Not only does the government over extend its stinking nose into the private lives of citizens in this matter, but I wouldn't be surprised if everyone of our postings are scrutinized by some government functionary sitting in some windowless office passing our postings on to another paranoid government functionary that decides to continue to monitor our postings.

People who had "nothing to hide" allowed the SS to get away with all of its immoral actions in Nazi Germany. This was how Hitler came to power. People "allowed" him to ascend to power because they had nothing to hide, they could keep him on a leash, and therefore were led into a sleeping false sense of security with his NSDAP.

This crap has to stop but quick. The next thing we will know the 4th Amenedment will be history in the name of "National Security".

[brien]

Quote by: bishop the thing i don't like and don't understand is how the government can evey contruct such a database without having explicit congressional approval beforehand.. my guess is that bush applied his typical broad (as far as the eye can see) interpretation of powers wrongly given to him by congress. once they build these things, they don't shut them off. so, it seems that they can do whatever they want.

The operative word everyone is using here is "secretive" database. The government has been doing this "secretly" since 9/11. This is what is so offensive. The government conveniently lacks the protocol for asking permission that they know they wont get from the US citizens.

[RickSp]

Quote by: brien The next thing we will know the 4th Amenedment will be history in the name of "National Security".

Isn't it already, for all intents and purposes?

From the NYTimes, posted a few minutes ago:

The article, in USA Today, said that the agency did not listen to the calls, but secretly obtained information on numbers dialed by "tens of millions of Americans" and used it for "data mining" — computer analysis of large amounts of information for clues or patterns to terrorist activity. ..... "The privacy of all Americans is fiercely protected in all our activities," {President Bush] said. "Our efforts are focused on Al Qaeda and their known associates."

Bush Denies Massive Spying on U.S. Citizens

So it appears that Bush considers tens of millions of Americans to be either "Al Qaeda [or] their known associates."

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: tman_ndsu08 Rick, I have nothing to hide. They can look all they want. If other people don't like that, then they should fight it if they want. I won't be joining them. That's all.

If and when the citizens of the U.S. find it necessary to forcibly oppose their government in the defense of the Constitution, they will find that they have absolutely no way to organize without the government knowing exactly what they are trying to do. It's people like you that are willingly giving up their rights that will make it impossible to mount any organized rebellion.

[tman_ndsu08]

There is no way for you to know that.

It's just that simple.


I don't have any rights, anyway. So how could I give them up?

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: tman I don't care if they have my records, I have nothing to hide.

How about the details of your sex life? How about your library records? You may not care that they know your political party, since you think they are looking out for you. But what if you could be denied a home loan because of your party? Just this week the Secretary of HUD declined a loan because the guy didnt like bush. Are we in Nazi Germany now?
Dissent is not only a right, but an obligation to a patriot when he sees his country going down the shitter. So drop the partisan nazi crap, and get behind the Constitution, not the retard in chief who wipes his ass with it.

BTW; Link
Waxman and Frank Call for Full Investigation Into HUD Contracting Under Secretary Jackson

[tman_ndsu08]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel How about the details of your sex life?

LOL! Such as? Who I've slept with? I could give a rat's ass if they knew that.

How about your library records?

I don't believe I've ever checked out a book.

No big deal to me.

You may not care that they know your political party, since you think they are looking out for you.

I'm not affiliated with any party.

I've never voted.

But what if you could be denied a home loan because of your party?

If a bank was stupid enough to deny someone a loan because of their party, then they rightfully deserve to go out of business (which would happen).

So drop the partisan nazi crap, and get behind the Constitution, not the retard in chief who wipes his ass with it.

The constitution is just a peice of paper.

It's just an opinion.

[jose]

quote
Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...0040805-3.html

They hate our freedoms
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...0010920-8.html
Bush says the terrorists hate our freedoms. So does he

[Apeman81]

An automated system reviews all the billions of phone connections made looking for connections containing phone numbers of of known or suspected terrorist used numbers.

The system flags only those connections containing "terrorist" phones for future investigation.

No one knows nor cares who you call and when you call them. Unless you're calling a terrorist. Then they pay attention. Humans do not see the lists of calls. The workforce to put eyes on all the calls connected within the US does not exist.

The record of every call we make from our phones already exists in the computers of your service provider. Another computer reviews those existent records.

Not exactly worthy of Orwellian (or should I say Huxleyan) fears.

Invasive? I know for a fact that a record exists ofevery call I make from one of the phones I have chosen to have assigned to me. I have no expectation of privacy concerning a record of those calls. As for the conversational content of those calls, I expect a reasonable level of privacy. Unless, of course, I'm calling a terrorist.