US tipping Mexico to Minutemen patrols

[Morgan_Freeman]

http://dailybulletin.com/news/ci_3799653

While Minuteman civilian patrols are keeping an eye out for illegal border crossers, the U.S. Border Patrol is keeping an eye out for Minutemen -- and telling the Mexican government where they are. According to three documents on the Mexican Secretary of Foreign Relations Web site, the U.S. Border Patrol is to notify the Mexican government as to the location of Minutemen and other civilian border patrol groups when they participate in apprehending illegal immigrants -- and if and when violence is used against border crossers. A U.S. Customs and Border Protection spokesman confirmed the notification process, describing it as a standard procedure meant to reassure the Mexican government that migrants' rights are being observed. "It's not a secret where the Minuteman volunteers are going to be," Mario Martinez said Monday. "This ... simply makes two basic statements -- that we will not allow any lawlessness of any type, and that if an alien is encountered by a Minuteman or arrested by the Minuteman, then we will allow that government to interview the person." Minuteman members were not so sanguine about the arrangement, however, saying that reporting their location to Mexican officials nullifies their effectiveness along the border and could endanger their lives. "Now we know why it seemed like Mexican officials knew where we were all the time," said Chris Simcox, founder of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps. "It's unbelievable that our own government agency is sending intelligence to another country. They are sending intelligence to a nation where corruption runs rampant, and that could be getting into the hands of criminal cartels. "They just basically endangered the lives of American people."

[Milton Bradley]

What could the possible motivation for our governments behavior be in this scenario?


Can any person put forward a rational explantion for that one?

[Morgan_Freeman]

Easy -- our government wants to ensure that the flow of persons across the border is as smooth and uninterrupted as possible.

[Apeman81]

Quote by: Morgan_Freeman Easy -- our government wants to ensure that the flow of persons across the border is as smooth and uninterrupted as possible.

More likely a knee-jerk, reactionary response to any citizen trying to enforce, or help officials enforce, the law.

Look at the way our culture treats the armed citizen; A redneck, probably racist yahoo waiting for his excuse to shoot somebody.

Morons!

[rmnunez]

I suspect the US government is concerned over the likelyhood undocumenteds will find themselves endangered, their lives at risk and denied basic human rights if they come accross some of these Minutemen.

[The Dunedan]

Oh, come off it, 'munez. These hasn't been a single documented instance in which the Minutemen have abused ANYONE. Not ONE such incident. There was an accusation made about three years ago that members of CBP had beaten a guy up, but that turned out to be a hoax. The facts is that members of the various civillian border groups routinely save lives by providing water and first aid to illegals who got lost or were abandoned by their guides. Of course, the call the Border Patrol while doing so, but they do not make hostile contact with illegals. They only make contact to render first aid. Otherwise, their orders are to observe and report.

Get your facts straight, please.

[Mia]

I'm sure it wasn't the USG's idea. Must've been a concession to the Mexican government. Also, it says "...when they participate in apprehending illegal immigrants..." not all the time.

Doesn't seem too unreasonable. They want to be informed if their citizens are aprehended, as they would be if caught by our official border patrol.

[brien]

Quote by: Morgan_Freeman http://dailybulletin.com/news/ci_3799653

Motivation???? To abrogate the effectiveness of the MM. I think the motivation is obvious and clearly shows the government's true intentions when it comes to controlling illegal immigration.

[bishop]

someone has to show this story to lou dobbs....

[tman_ndsu08]

Quote by: Morgan_Freeman Easy -- our government wants to ensure that the flow of persons across the border is as smooth and uninterrupted as possible.

That's fine with me.

[Morgan_Freeman]

Quote by: tman_ndsu08 That's fine with me.

I, for one, think rule of law is a good thing.

Why can't they just play it honest and lift the quotas?

[rmnunez]

members of the various civillian border groups routinely save lives by providing water and first aid to illegals who got lost or were abandoned by their guides.

Yes, but we are talking about one civilian border group, these minute men not others groups. Other groups (usually religiously-inspired and led) are concerned with rescuing lost undocumenteds, giving them water and assistance. The minute men groups seek to prevent undocumenteds from crossing, to intercept them, they have a hostile attitude towards undocumenteds. Other groups trying to help the undocumenteds are the ones who under earlier versions of the immigration bill were going to be criminalized for providing any assistance.

Why can't they just play it honest and lift the quotas?

I can think of just 2 reasons; it would be politically unpopular and it would erode the advantage undocumented employers enjoy now.

[weasel]

Concerning the Minutemen Project (the so-called "vigilantes"), Glenn Beck (the radio host) had an interview with Chris Simcox, the founder of the project.

From Fusion magazine, January-February edition 2006:

Glenn Beck: What do you think is most misunderstood about the Minuteman Project?

Chris Simcox: That we are anti-immigrant. People always want to equate border security with being anti-immigration. And nothing could be farther from the truth. It's about national security and public safety. When you have secure borders, it helps to protect everyone inside those borders. What we are most concerned with is the out of control crime like drugs, gangs, etc.

GB: How many people are in your organization?

CS: We have around 5,000 trained volunteers.

GB: Many people think that the vast majority of those coming here illegaly are just good people looking for a better life.

CS: Actually, according to the Justice Department and Attorney General's office, nearly 10,000 people have been murdered here in the US since 9/11 at the hands of illegal immigrants. Those are not nice people. That's obscene. But the victims all die one at a time so it doesn't make national headlines.

GB: Some critics like to paint you as a vigilante group. How do you respond to them?

CS: We are nothing more than a neighborhood watch group. We support law enforcement by working within the law. Vigilantes are judge, jury, and executioners. We're a humanitarian group as much as anything, as documented by the 186 men, women, and children who would have died if not for us.

"Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life."

- President John F. Kennedy

[rmnunez]

Weasel, you should know, as a good united statian, that "inclusiveness" is a prerequisite for all reputable organizations in that country. The Minute men couldn't be otherwise, but they are encouraging the armed confrontation of defenseless individuals on an ethnic basis as I don't suppose they train these Minute men to establish nationality through their sniperscopes. When the target is chosen due primarily to specific physical (ethnic or racial) features, it does seem rather 'non-inclusive' to me. Hispanics will drop out of the organization as the racial-supremacist attitudes in this group become apparent to them.

[Lilith]

I don't like the MM. They are fucktards. And what's sad, now they are getting the black man to preach the rhetoric, "The Mexicans are taking our jobs"....no, my friend, America sold your jobs overseas long ago, I think it started in the 70's, nothing like keeping the Mexicans and Blacks at each other's throats. The Latinos are taking over this country and the whites don't like it for sure and the blacks are getting worried now too. Damn that sounds like a conspriacy theory...shit. I don't like the MM, I really, really, really don't like them.

[weasel]

Quote by: rmnunez Weasel, you should know, as a good united statian, that "inclusiveness" is a prerequisite for all reputable organizations in that country. The Minute men couldn't be otherwise, but they are encouraging the armed confrontation of defenseless individuals on an ethnic basis as I don't suppose they train these Minute men to establish nationality through their sniperscopes. When the target is chosen due primarily to specific physical (ethnic or racial) features, it does seem rather 'non-inclusive' to me. Hispanics will drop out of the organization as the racial-supremacist attitudes in this group become apparent to them.

And the ten thousand, innocent, legitamite American citizens killed at the hands of illegal aliens (mostly Mexcicans) does't mean anything to you? But why should you care. You're sitting in Mexico City. Its America's problem and illegal immigration is a plague to us and a blessing to you. Its a rip off of the hard earned freedom some immigrants rightfully waited in line for.

And it is on this matter (illegal immigration) that the Republican party has completely screwed up on in support of buisnesses over the general American populace.

From: http://src1.epnet.com/detail?sid=a15...2&vid=31226721

“Many of the residents live on ranches on the U.S.-Mexico border where there is no fence or barrier. These ranchers have built their own barbed wire fences to keep their cattle from entering Mexico. However, the fences are routinely destroyed often by human and drug smugglers driving directly over the fences. Earlier this year a 1.1 mile section of a rancher's border fence was stolen, leaving the border wide open for his cattle to be lost completely. Despite the fact that the fence is on a 60 ft. government right away that runs along the border, the Federal government will not reimburse the ranchers for the destruction of the fence. The ranchers rebuilt the 1.1 mile fence at their own cost of $5,000. Yet, the fence is continually broken, costing the ranchers $250 per day to maintain it. Other ranchers inform me that the solar windmills that power water generation for their cattle are constantly damaged costing $800 per windmill to repair.

Furthermore, residents are faced with the daily task of cleaning up the massive amounts of debris left behind by the illegal immigrants, including clothes, food, trash, syringes, human feces- enough to fill several tractor trailers full in the words of one of my constituents.....The human smugglers are partnering with Mexican bandits, who are robbing the illegal immigrants as the smugglers bring them across the border. Competing bandits are beginning to fight over the groups of smuggled immigrants even on the U.S. side. One of the ranchers and her daughter-while checking their border fence for damage on horseback-recently rode upon a bandit shoot out. Thankfully, they were not injured, this time. The bandit activity has become so prevalent that the Border Patrol has even warned residents not to go near their own border fences. It is patently offensive when the government agency responsible for protecting the residents warns them not to go repair their own border fence- a fence the Federal government refuses to maintain-because the Border Patrol cannot effectively gain control of the border."

This is what organizations like the Minute Men are dedeicated to preventing. Mexico is playing the parasite by sending its poor, desperate, citizens over to our country. I am not unsympathetic to the plight of these people but what they and every other illegal immigrant needs to learn is how to wait patiently in line applying for citizenship. By entering this country illegally you are cutting in line of someone is following the proper procedure for enjoying the benefits of this nation. If it was wrong in the 4th grade, what makes you think that it's not wrong now?

Returning to the topic of this thread, it is infuriating, therefore, that our own government is undermining those dedicated to protecting this nation. How many more legitmate, American citizens must die because of the situations illegal immigration are creating? How many congressman can say who will end up on the other side of a gun barrel held by an illegal alien? Until the U.S. Mexican border patrol is vastly improved, organizations like the minute men will continue doing their best making sure that you, or anyone you know or love, will not be the next victim.

[rmnunez]

Tell us more about the 10 thousand united statians killed by Mexican undocumenteds, Weasel.