Exxon CEO: Use less of our stuff

[Sean]

http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/02/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes

Exxon chief executive Rex Tillerson said Tuesday there is little lawmakers can do to combat rising energy costs and urged consumers to reduce demand by using less. "We just have to ask people to make sure they are using energy wisely," Tillerson told CNN after a meeting with congressmen in Washington. "Be efficient with it, don't waste it." He said Exxon, for its part, was investing $20 billion over the next five years to develop new sources of energy. "[We're] developing supply from all over the world, including a lot of investment in this country and some new developments. And, you know, all of that is directed at trying to address the tightness in the supply situation. "There's not anything that can be done that is going to change this situation overnight," he said. "It's all about supply and demand fundamentals."

[bishop]

i agree with tillerson overall, as do the analysts and lawyers who've repeatedly looked to find fault in the energy industry for gouging.

much of the complaining is coming from people, who against logical judgement, chose to buy these huge gas guzzling suv's.. these people seem to want it all on a silver platter. imo, these people don't deserve a rebate, tax holiday, new intrusive "gouging" laws or any other bad "solution" our corrupt government can devise.



the thing that stands out to me is that throughout the 90's, most sedans/coupes became more fuel efficient (at the worst, there was no change in efficiency). despite this, consumption steadily grew - because everyone just had to drive a big beastly suv.

[Technosoul]

This helps to confirm what I posted in the other thread "gas prices on rise for summer" and I wish this post had been added there - the news media keeps repeating what the oil compaines have to say - while also depending on them to buy advertising time on their stations - not fair.

[bishop]

please.. it's hardly just the media here. analysts, economists, lawyers, etc., have all looked into the issue and the general concensus is that companies like exxon haven't been doing anything wrong.

[Osborn F Enready]

If we would have had an "INFORMED ELECTORATE" we would have been voting people in to address these issues years ago, since peak oil was known about since the 70's.

WE don't have an informed electorate, or a free press.

We have a sleeping populace, that is becoing immune to fear due to its non-stop bantering by imaginary hobgoblins created by the government.

Sheeple.

[bishop]

well, we're pretty informed despite the persistent complaints about the media...

if we can be informed, then so too can the rest of the public. they're just lazy.

[brien]

Quote by: Sean http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/02/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes

As Mr Tillerson pointed out this morning on NBC, the price of crude in 1998 was $18 a barrel. 70% of their profits are gained ouside the US. He also stated their profits have increased threefold and their taxes have increase fourfold. If anyone is "gouging" the American public on fuel it is the US government. I say shame on the US for not preparing for $100 barrel oil that is sure to come.

The politicians and US

Won't explore for more oil.
Won't drill in ANWR
Won't drill off the California coast
Won't drill off the Gulf of Mexico. Mexico will.
Won't drill off the Fla coast. Castro will.
Won't build anymore refineries. Castro will Venezuela will
Won't convert the gasoline delivery system to ethanol or hydrogen
Won't build any light rails in cities
Won't build wind farms off Cape Cod because it will spoil the elites view.
Won't eliminate the gasoline tax

Seems like we find ten ways to Sunday why we won't solve the enegy issues instead of finding ten ways to Sunday to solve the energy crisis. We make our bed here and we are now lying in it.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Exxon chief executive Rex Tillerson He said Exxon, for its part, was investing $20 billion over the next five years to develop new sources of energy

I wonder how much of that $20 large is earmarked for leveling Iran.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Os If we would have had an "INFORMED ELECTORATE" we would have been voting people in to address these issues years ago, since peak oil was known about since the 70's.

The problem isnt peak oil. We have an intentional shortage. Though peak oil could be a problem some day, even soon. It wouldnt hurt to act "as if", and use science and known alternative and renewable energy. As for the "INFORMED ELECTORATE" ....The real problem is the electorate didnt really choose who is in power. Who owns the machines chooses our leaders. Elections are but a charade. Until that is changed, we are but an annoyance to them. They will go through the motions of an election as an opiate for the masses. An informed electorate would run Diebold and ES & S, out on a rail. That aint happening, yet. Dont look for any real change until then. The ruling class is planted by Oil interests that will not rock the boat. Look for that to change ........never. In a hundred years the same corporation (Our government) will be selling us all bottled oxygen and charging exorbitant prices for "their" product, because of "Peak Oxygen", caused by the transfer of carbon from oil below, to the air above. It will be too late for Windmills, then, because the air will be more sludgy then. For the grand kids.

Quote by: brien Seems like we find ten ways to Sunday why we won't solve the enegy issues instead of finding ten ways to Sunday to solve the energy crisis. We make our bed here and we are now lying in it.

The primary problem is there is no competition. We now have only 4 Oil corporations in virtual monopoly. There were 20 oil companies not so long ago, now the cabal has been closing refineries down to lower production. they are cornering the market There is no shortage of crude, only an artificial funneling of product. And the more worldwide reserves that are secured, coupled with a government junta rolling back fuel consumption (and environmental) standards in the automotive industry and a failure to promote viable alternatives.....Its just plain criminal.

I recommend this:

Dreaming War: Blood for Oil and the Cheney-Bush Junta (2.95 New/Used)
It was written in the perpetuity between Afghan and Iraq wars.

ExxonMobil History The fruitful relationship continues today between ExxonMobil and the Saudi Arabian Oil Company, or Saudi Aramco, created by Royal Decree to manage the Kingdom’s energy resources. <snip> ExxonMobil’s commitment to Saudi Arabia is genuine, resilient and long-lasting. We look forward to continuing a relationship of mutual respect and mutual benefit as we, together with our partners in Saudi Arabia, focus on new opportunities to expand the Kingdom’s energy infrastructure.

I havent seen any loyalty oaths to their American customers. But I have seen Dumbya holding hands with Suadi princes.
Bush came to Sacramento about 10 days ago, he did a photo-op at a Hydrogen Cell company, which is an absurdity. Anything viable is at least 10 years away in that technology. Even then it is not such a great alternative. We need CHANGE NOW! Not in ten years. We will be nuked in ten years when the world gets fed up with our empire building. Simpler alternatives are available, we just need the pumps installed and factory conversions and conversion kits for Bio-Diesel. Its gonna take a while for them to control all the land that can produce vegetable oil, though. Thats the best explanation for the delay. But they are working on it with the new Immenent Domain laws.

[brien]

[quote=gr8fuldaniel].
The primary problem is there is no competition. We now have only 4 Oil corporations in virtual monopoly. There were 20 oil companies not so long ago, now the cabal has been closing refineries down to lower production. they are cornering the market There is no shortage of crude, only an artificial funneling of product. And the more worldwide reserves that are secured, coupled with a government junta rolling back fuel consumption (and environmental) standards in the automotive industry and a failure to promote viable alternatives.....Its just plain criminal.



Dan: While I share your concern for monopolies, besides an overall plan for altenative fuels for the future, I must also stick with my 10 ways to combat the problem. The Federal Government is just as much to blame as "Big Oil" for being asleep at the switch since the 1970's. They could have provided tax incentives for weaning American off the big oil tit. Only collusion could produce what is happening today. Corporate finance of campaigns for the friends of oil to elect oil friendly candidates can produce the do nothing legislators of the past and present. Dems and Republicans alike.

If I were "big oil", I would finance every green cadidiate I could find that restricted exploration, production, and promoted a moratorium on building refineries, to insure that the price of oil would remain high. I don't think you can indict "big oil" without also smelling the good ol boys in DC as well. PEEEEEEEEEE U :eek:

[Technosoul]

Quote by: bishop please.. it's hardly just the media here. analysts, economists, lawyers, etc., have all looked into the issue and the general concensus is that companies like exxon haven't been doing anything wrong.

You mean nothing they cannot legally get away with. People get away with doing wrong when they can get away with doing wrong things legally. Oh hum - the old no exit scam put into a different format - so simple solution - make it illegal and then it would be wrong - how hard is that?

[Technosoul]

[quote=brien]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel . The primary problem is there is no competition. We now have only 4 Oil corporations in virtual monopoly. There were 20 oil companies not so long ago, now the cabal has been closing refineries down to lower production. they are cornering the market There is no shortage of crude, only an artificial funneling of product. And the more worldwide reserves that are secured, coupled with a government junta rolling back fuel consumption (and environmental) standards in the automotive industry and a failure to promote viable alternatives.....Its just plain criminal. IQUOTE] Dan: While I share your concern for monopolies, I must also stick with my 10 ways to combat the problem. The Federal Government is just as much to blame as "Big Oil" for being asleep at the switch since the 1970's. They could have provided tax incentives for weaning American off the big oil tit. Only collusion could produce what is happening today. Corporate finance of campaigns for the friends of oil to elect oil friendly candidates can produce the do nothing legislators of the past and present. Dems and Republicans alike. If I were "big oil", I would finance every green cadidiate I could find that restricted exploration, production, and a moratorium on building refineries, to insure that the price of oil would remain high. I don't think you can indict "big oil" without also smelling the good ol boys in DC as well. PEEEEEEEEEE U :eek:

Yeah - it is not like the old idea "if the product costs too much go buy a cheaper one". That would be like saying you can change the radio station if you do not like it - but then you find out their is only one station left to listen too. Removing Saddam did in effect remove the "cheap oil" that he offered some countries during the "stuff or oil" days (embargo). He even made sweet deals here in America as well as with France, Russia, and China. But now he is in jail and so - no more competition from someone "outside" of the control of the "big boys". Perhaps Iran? But how long will that last?

Am I the only person that has seen how this all was played out - surely others must have come to that same conclusion?

[bishop]

Quote by: technosoul You mean nothing they cannot legally get away with. People get away with doing wrong when they can get away with doing wrong things legally. Oh hum - the old no exit scam put into a different format - so simple solution - make it illegal and then it would be wrong - how hard is that?

huh??

if we wanted to, we could make gay sex illegal.. does that mean that the law is just?

in the same light, we could make it illegal for oil companies to charge for gas at the current market price.. would that be a just law?

[Technosoul]

Okay kids - stop wasting so much gas and then you can afford our prices - in other words - stay home and stop spending all your time out shopping and spending money at stores so that our economy will bloom and grow.

Now we know you spent a lot of money to buy that pretty new car - but don't use it so much, just park it and ... and... watch TV instead - we oil folks spend millions to run ads on TV and so you should say home and watch them - then you can learn our environmentally friendly oil is - did you know fish like our off shore oil platforms?

Do we honestly believe that a oil CEO would encourge people to buy less of his product - ha! He knows you gotta buy it to get to work and to do normal stuff - like taking the kids to some school event or whatever - the little we might waste for a useless trip is not the problem, it is the majority of the gas that we must have to get to work and so forth that is important. Most of it is not wasted.

Trying to put the blame back onto the consumer - old trick of the trade - I am not fooled by such yakety yak, are you?

But yet I do see a bright side to all this - less smog as people cannot buy as much gas, less impact on global warming - and more encouragement to find clean burning alternatives. Less cancer producing toxic fumes to make people sick - that is in fact good news. Perhaps it is about time anyway for us to wake up and find another way to get to work and what-have-you. Leave the dinosaurs in their tombs and forget the snake oil - invest in corn while you still can get in on the bottom floor. Get a copyright for hemp oil while you still can. Trade in your SUV and get the most economical car on the market -

and stop "wasting time" listening to some oil industry CEO.

Time to make those changes - the time is now - so lets just do it - and be done with oil dependancy once and for all.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel . The primary problem is there is no competition. We now have only 4 Oil corporations in virtual monopoly. There were 20 oil companies not so long ago, now the cabal has been closing refineries down to lower production. they are cornering the market There is no shortage of crude, only an artificial funneling of product. And the more worldwide reserves that are secured, coupled with a government junta rolling back fuel consumption (and environmental) standards in the automotive industry and a failure to promote viable alternatives.....Its just plain criminal.

gr8fuldaniel](brien) fair comment. Though for info the crudes available are often the "wrong" grades. The heavier and more polluted crudes are mixed with lighter sweeter grades. Primarily this is to avoid high environmental tarrifs and reduce the effect heavier crudes have on equipment. The industry has waited for the market/government to enourage investment in being better able to refine more of the heavier ends (There are less sweet crudes available).

brien corrected as you rightly pointed out :)

[brien]

Quote by: Technosoul Yeah - it is not like the old idea "if the product costs too much go buy a cheaper one". That would be like saying you can change the radio station if you do not like it - but then you find out their is only one station left to listen too. Removing Saddam did in effect remove the "cheap oil" that he offered some countries during the "stuff or oil" days (embargo). He even made sweet deals here in America as well as with France, Russia, and China. But now he is in jail and so - no more competition from someone "outside" of the control of the "big boys". Perhaps Iran? But how long will that last? Am I the only person that has seen how this all was played out - surely others must have come to that same conclusion?

So you are blaming the removal of Saddam on the oil problems of today? Try going back to October of 1973. Do some historical research and you will find America has been asleep at the wheel since then. We have had 33 years to wean ourselves off the "big oil" tit, and we have done NOTHING.

[brien]

Quote by: Arawn-ap-Hywel brien fair comment. Though for info the crudes available are often the "wrong" grades. The heavier and more polluted crudes are mixed with lighter sweeter grades. Primarily this is to avoid high environmental tarrifs and reduce the effect heavier crudes have on equipment. The industry has waited for the market/government to enourage investment in being better able to refine more of the heavier ends (There are less sweet crudes available).

Arawn: This was actually a quote from Dan cited by me but was not highlighted in green for some reason. You need to direct you comment to Dan. Sorry for the confusion.

[Arawn-ap-Hywel]

Quote by: brien Arawn: This was actually a quote from Dan cited by me but was not highlighted in green for some reason. You need to direct you comment to Dan. Sorry for the confusion.

Don't be sorry brien it was I whom created the confusion :)

[bishop]

Quote by: technosoul Trying to put the blame back onto the consumer - old trick of the trade - I am not fooled by such yakety yak, are you?

the consumer is partially responsible for our oil problems - particularly those who decided to buy a wasteful gas guzzler and contribute to suburban sprawl. myself, i ride public transportation every day and drive a car that gets 30/40mpg city/highway - so i could care less that it costs a bit more to fill my tank (i only fill it up once a month as it is). not to say that i'm the norm, but if more people consumed gas at the rate that i consume gas, it'd be a hell of a lot cheaper because the demand would be much, much lower. what kind of car are you driving?

and then you have all of the waste due to suburban sprawl.. people've built their entire lives around the assumption that oil would always be nice and cheap, with a seemingly infinite supply. they oppose building refineries in their towns, they oppose building wind farms, etc... even better when these people go and buy themselves a nice wasteful suv that gets 7 mpg. is their little piggy lifestyle the energy company's problem? not in my opinion.

so yes, the higher prices are, in part, due to high demand.

the energy companies would all survive if oil fell by half its current price/barrel.. how is that so? because when the energy companies create their capital budgets for their various exploration/drilling projects, they estimate that oil will cost $20-$30/barrel. (and, it costs them about $15-$20 to produce 1 barrel of oil.) everything over those amounts represents windfall profits. this is the leading argument behind those advocating windfall taxes.

and, the people pushing for windfall taxes aren't exactly saying that the companies are guilty of gouging.. they just want them to contribute a bit more to the government's coffers. of course, raising taxes on oil companies will not necessarily translate into any benefit for consumers - but i guess it will make some people feel good that they "stuck it" to the big oil companies.

[Morgan_Freeman]

Quote by: brien Won't build any light rails in cities

Please... light rail is NOT an effective solution. It's mostly a liberal wet dream.