Is The Dark Knight a fascist screed?

[barts]

I begin this thread despite not having seen The Dark Knight Rises.

The notion has been raised that The Dark Knight Rises Is a Pro-Fascist Movie.

This is probably the best overtly pro-fascist film I’ve seen since Leni Riefenstahl’s heyday.

From the Toronto Star, Batman joins the police to take on Occupy Wall Street,

Film critics have rightly picked up on a disturbing message in the latest instalment of Christopher Nolan’s hugely popular Dark Knight series of Batman movies. Fascism, the film suggests, is just great...

Bruce Wayne, Batman’s billionaire alter ego, spends his time managing his declining health and the anxieties of retirement, until he is coaxed back into his batsuit by a violent group of anti-capitalist crusaders. The activists, led by an enormous, incomprehensible masked mercenary named Bane, expose the state’s lies and foment a successful popular uprising with rhetoric ripped directly from the Occupy Wall Street movement. (At one point, the villains literally occupy the stock exchange.)

Left to its citizens and their vicious, hypocritical leaders, Gotham succumbs to chaos and brutality — an updated version of the French Revolution’s Reign of Terror, with Bane a muscle-bound Robespierre. Kangaroo courts, political murders and looting — this is what we get, the film tells us, when the people win power.

The city’s only chance for salvation: a crackdown by police and Batman, a charter member of the 1 per cent. In Nolan’s world, rows of armed, marching police are a symbol of hope, a Warren Buffett with martial arts training is Gotham’s only possible saviour, and a populist movement, which in many ways resembles the one still playing out in the real world, is shown to be fraudulent and evil.

And a commentary on Youtube,



From the first source above,

Fascism may not always be palatable or pleasant, the film tells us, but it is necessary and it works. At no point in the movie do fascist solutions fail, except in cases where they are not fascist enough. The strongmen who Do What Must Be Done, the classic excuse of the fascist, are always right.

So, is The Dark Knight Rises pro-fascist, and does it matter? Is fascism the solution to America's problems? It seems some artists think so.

[grandpa]

I begin this thread despite not having seen...

I haven't seen it, either. In fact, I only saw the Dark Knight because one of my buddies wanted to see it, and I think she even paid for my ticket.

I will comment a bit on that movie, as I haven't seen the newest one. Despite
the messages to the contrary, "anarchy" is not equal to what the Joker was up to.

And no, I'm not just saying that because I'm anarchist-leaning. It's actually a pretty substantial theme in the movie -- the Joker advocates complete chaos, then authority essentially comes in to save the day.
In one scene, Batman -- the billionaire genius hero -- goes so far as to drastically invade public privacy in order to locate the Joker.
That all sends an obvious message, at least to anyone with half a brain.

As your video suggests, people shouldn't take this too, too, seriously.

Thankfully there are antidotes (so to speak) to movies like this. I just watched Terry Gilliam's "Brazil" this morning (a bit of a coincidence), which in many ways presents the exact opposite message, and beautifully so.

Grandpa h.

[Yarn]

I haven't seen Dark Knight rises, but the reign of terror did happen. Lenin did happen. Mao did happen. I think this movie probably ought to disturb only leftists who are so leftist that they can't countenance a cautionary tale that states there is an extreme that is too extreme.

If you take away proper law and order and put a crazy demagogue in power, madness and evil prevails. I think most people would consider that obvious rather than fascist.

And if the Occupy movement doesn't want to be misconstrued, then it can start by actually having an actual collective platform, that isn't vague/lacking in specific solutions, rather than a cacophony of individual platforms that any deciever can malicously or earnestly falsely claim is the platform of the movement as a whole.

[Angry Citizen]

Everyone who posts in this thread whose first sentence is "I haven't seen TDKR" or some variation thereof deserves a world of agony. None of you have the slightest idea what you're talking about.

Batman doesn't face down Occupy Wall Street hordes. Batman faces down a legion of mercenaries who trapped the entire police force in an underground cavern, threatened the city with a massive nuclear weapon, and freed every last one of Harvey Dent's prized scumbags and gave them all weapons. In accomplishing this, the legion of mercenaries didn't "occupy a stock exchange", they crippled Wayne Enterprises by buying a bunch of bad stocks in Bruce Wayne's name. This was done so the mercenaries would have access to Wayne Enterprises' massive stockpile of military hardware. Bruce Wayne ends up saving the day and leaving his fortune behind, going to live in a different country. The fight against the rich was pure rhetoric based on the fact that Bane wished to cause the total destruction of Gotham City, as he was a member of the League of Shadows and shared Ra's al-Ghul's desires. Batman understood the excesses and the desire to reform Gotham City, but disagreed with the destructive methodology.

There now, since you all seemed so keen on spouting out without bothering to inform yourselves, now you're informed. No fascism necessary. If anything, it's supposed to mirror the Soviet Union with its socialist rhetoric but non-socialist ideals, rather than the Occupy anti-capitalistas.

[Yarn]

It would be nice if my college had a movie theater or I had a car or if my college wasn't in the middle of nowhere. I hadn't read a synopsis because I didn't want to spoil it, but, excuses aside, you're right that I should've before posting in a thread about it.

[Chris the Chees]

It isn't remotely fascist, though it does have some questionable things to say about leftwing politics. And I have seen it.

[Angry Citizen]

See it again. If anything, there is a bias in favor of left wing policies. Just not left wing policies at the barrel of a gun.

[Charlatan]

I think it isn't that good. It has moments, and starts very well.

[Yarn]

Well the previous ones were good.

I was particularly interested in his grapple gun. Apparently it is supposed to be magnetic, which is a shame because I was hoping it would be Gecko-tech.
http://batman.wikia.com/wiki/Grapple_Gun_(Nolan_Films)

The league of shadows idea however was kind of stupid in this incarnation. Raz Ghoul is a lot funner when he is an extreme environmentalist. The reasons given for what they do in the new movies, or at least in the first 2, just don't make sense. One of the great things about the Dark Knight was that they were absent, so the movie was a lot more reasonable.

[barts]

Everyone who posts in this thread whose first sentence is "I haven't seen TDKR" or some variation thereof deserves a world of agony.

Seems unnecessarily harsh.

[Yarn]

A silly statement for a silly topic. *shrugs*

No offense incidentally. Silly but fun, though we all should've seen the movie first.

[Yarn]

Just saw the movie. Worst of the 3. Way too much of it was implausible (army of police with pistols versus army of thugs with machine guns and tanks turns explicably into one giant fist fight???; Wayne's paralysis is healed by punching him in the back???), and the league of shadows never made sense because their motives didn't make sense.

I liked how they wrapped things up at the end though; with the exception perhaps of the passing of the torch to someone who didn't really seem up to the task.