dotComa

Well duh..externalities create challenge.challenge creates response. The old action reaction issue.

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Originally posted by rez+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (rez)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Does everybody like to be the best at something?  Best forum poster? Best at their job?  Best at their school work?  Best at forming opinions? Best at being social? Best at being un social?  These are all status seeking "sub-groups"  which brings me to GROUPS -- who are in these?  Well higher up people (the rich)[/b]

I think all people like to either be the best at something or control their environment enough to convince themselves that they are indeed the best at something-even if it is all in their head, but this is just opinion-better ask "everyone".

I now know what you were talking about when you asked to what level I belong-be less ambiguous next time. I would argue that wealth has actually impeded the cleavages in the survival of the fittest pyramid. Wealth lets rich people push their dumb kids forward into realms they should not be in (industry, school, etc). This in turn lowers the overall productivity, distinction, etc of the given establishment over time in my opinion.

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Originally posted by rez The basic idea is - if one fails at high status group, one will form a sub-group and be good at that - and so on.

I would argue that this system of Darwinism is hurt by those who have the means to control the system in ways that nature would not intend (money). Besides, the reverse effect is true. Genius’s can live and die in poverty due to externalities created by wealthy dumb kids who either become consumed in greed, or fail to recognize true skill when recruiting, etc.

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Originally posted by rez Everybody wants an identity!  Opinions, Tattoos, job description, interests are all forms of identity....its our basic biological instinct!

ABRA CADABRA!

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Originally posted by rez Now this is true, But most of these things are instinctual.  However sexism and racism have been snowballed turning into a nutured thing.  Because we Humans do have reason right? haha no we just have More instincts!  The overall view of it is we still carry in us MANY our primative biological instincts.

This is semantics. Reason can be considered a human instinct. It is my instinct to sometimes be random, to build tools, discover, ponder, etc. Also, it is different depending on who the individual is, so it really is not a universal human instinct. Reason is very broad, and thus it would be foolish to label it so universaly.

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Originally posted by rez Just because we punish people for doing something wrong does not mean we have reason.  I would like a better example of what REASON is.

Reason can be explained as logic. It is something that lets us realize how things are, what they can be, what they can not be, etc. It is human reason that lets me cut-away at your statements and find things that appear to be, in my opinion, errors. I could give you other examples too.

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Originally posted by rez Yeah so what?  they have fucked up genes.  My theory is its a way that can help keep the population at a certain point.  Did love come before sex? Were there homosexuals 1 million years ago? Love is a term coined by our language and denial of our animal ancestors.

It is a fairly common occurrence if it's just "fucked up genes". This issue is still an unsolved one, but perhaps they are something to counter the huge amount of orphans or something-who knows haha. Also, who is to say how long gay people have been around?

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Originally posted by rez They are risking their survival so they can be on the news (ego) and Maybe climb the ladder of status by becoming a fire fighter who commands how to handle a fire.

Or they want an adrenaline rush, or they truly enjoy the rare kind of self-interest that actually benefits other people-it is indeed a rare thing. Like here for example, I am trying to be good at proving people like you wrong, and at the same time I am doing something responsible (influencing your perspective).

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This conversation is not based on primative and shallow concepts such as Love, Reason, politics and religion but where the human (race) is actually going.[/quote]

Primative concepts such as reason and politics? These things do in fact decide where we go. Politics kills parts of our species every day, and decides where money is allocated-which has huge impacts on development of certain groups of people.

Reason is what has gotten us this far, and it is not shallow nor is it primative-it is incomprehensible.

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I have said it tons of other times on this board and I will say it again  Buy  The Human Zoo - by desmond Harris...this book will change your opinion on everything.[/quote]

It sounds like you do not read a whole lot, and have been convinced by an authority figure that is the author :) Not saying he is wrong, but you make such absolute and blanketed statements about things you could not possibly be certain about. Do not close the book of evolution because you decided to go read a book, and actually form an understanding in your head that you know the answers (guess this proves that we all want to be good at something, and we will construct an environment or a tone around us that gives us this personal impression).