[G. Adams]

</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Ron,)
</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (G. Adams,)
What we ought to do is personal opinion, as is what can be defined as just.  In Hitler's eyes, and Saddam's eyes, and every other dictators, what they were doing was just.  All the matters is who has the will and ability to enforce their version of justice.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

So anyone having enough power is applying justice by any action they choose? This does not make any sense to me. I am not one to subscribe to moral relativism and that is what is being described here- "It is justice if I say it is justice."

I believe there are moral absolutes, having remained absolutes throughout human history and not influenced by any cultural bias. I know of no culture where theft is a "good" thing, here and now or any time in history. Theft has always been "bad" behavior.If no set of moral ideas were truer or better than any other, there would be no sense in preferring civilized morality to savage morality. The fact is that we all do believe some moralities are better than others.

The moment we say one morality is better than another, we are measuring both by some standard, saying one of them conforms to the standard more closely than the other. Keep in mind, now, that this standard is neither of the two, but rather the measuring rod in which we are applying the two moralities.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

It is not justice if I say it is, it is justice if I make it justice. There is no such thing as right or wrong, good or bad, even if everyone in the world could agree to what is right/wrong.

IF God exists, and has set a universal code for what is right/wrong, then yes there clearly is universal values. But, because God has put them there, it is only right/wrong because God has the ability to enforce it.

Despite how it sounds, I personally do have codes and values for myself to live by, and if someone goes against what I feel is right or wrong I will fight it because
a) I'd feel guilty to not to
b) Because I can

But this is just my conscience, combined with my will to enforce what I feel is right.