[pikatore]

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin We are not only violent, I will admit. And I will also accept that our intelligence has made us come up with a number of ways to commit violence. But, it is that use of our intelligence for the search of even more ways to kill ourselves in ever more efficient means over a wide range of reasons and in sheer scope that comparatively gives us up to being an animal prone to more violence than other animals.

It's totally irrelevant. Just because we are able to concieve of more efficient ways to kill other people, and work towards those aims, that doesn't make us MORE violent than animals. Animals have all the tools they need to kill something, or at the least feed, quickly and efficiently. And they tend use the tools they have quite liberally.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin Appeal to ignorance.

That was more of an aside, but yes, you are right.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin Kinda, but not quite accurate. Modified: Wanting to consume more efficiently(often much further than our lives require) and control our environment better, we have therefore sought to master tool use and made spoons and forks and knives. Analogically constructed against: Wanting to consume or control more recourses to increase our chances for survival relative to other compeditor groups within our species, we have therefore evolved to use our intelligence to master tool use and weapons to give us an advantage over others.

It isn't the 'wanting' that caused us to master simple tool use, or evolve to use our intellegence to outsmart enemies! It's evolution ITSELF that has caused us to be so intellegent, and a lust for power and growth comes with the package, as it does for pretty much any organism in existence.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin The only thing is, we do not commit violence as most animals do -- i.e. for survival -- but ALSO for greed and gluttony.

Why are those things so different to each other? A pack of lions fighting over a carcass don't just eat thier fill, enough to 'survive', and kindly let the other ones at it! Each of them would take the whole damn lot if they could! If that doesn't exhibit greed or gluttony and is purely 'survival' based, then so is everything we do as humans.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin Different herds of the same species will sometimes come together in mass migrations. There is a lot of tolerance amongst same species animals.

Uhh, they usually are herbivorous animals, if you are talking about land animals migrating across Africa. So the 'tolerance' is due to obvious reasons.

As for inter-species migrations with carnivores, I'd be interested if you could point me to any examples.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin Maybe you could clarify or reword this a little better. If they are neutral to one another, then why would they have a desire to kick the other`s arse. The neutrality would then not exist.

Not desire, POWER. If they think they can pull it off and get away with it (e.g. kill the alpha male without getting killing himself), you don't need to ask them twice.

Quote by: StrongHeartsWin And why is that relevant to us not being more disposed to violence amongst ourselves than other animals amongst themselves?

Becuase it's the complexity of those pathways which clouds your reasoning, since they are totally irrelevant to the discussion. They are motivated ultimately by selfish reasons, even if they be altruistic, and they result in the death of another organism. Something that other animals share.