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harrythehorton · Feb 6, 2008, 11:46 pm

Artificial in this subject can be defined as:
1. made by human skill; produced by humans (opposed to natural): artificial flowers.
2. imitation; simulated; sham: artificial vanilla flavoring.

Intelligence:
1. capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding, and similar forms of mental activity; aptitude in grasping truths, relationships, facts, meanings, etc.

Rather than debating definitions, let's have them defined as they are generally understood with the subject.

First off. Never say never. Don't say something could never be possible, because honestly, such an assumption will in many cases be proven wrong with time(granted it's somewhere near semi-understandable or conceptable bounds).

Artificial Intelligence: a simulation of a capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding, and similar forms of mental activity(to combine definitions).

Now with the literal definition of the terms. Yes, it's possible. It's being done now, there are too many examples that are meant to SIMulate intelligence. Though, that's not the definition people are normally referring to when talking about the future.

So, the question is: are sentience, comprehension, reasoning, and a valid consciousness possible within the bounds of a machine?

Many people have tried to write a program that reacts to user input(variables), who's responses are only based off the program's functions (predetermined, in a sense, responses... even if set to random[random what =)]). This is only a simulation. Then some programs were written which could connect, only mathematically, relationships between words and how they relate to each other saying "IT UNDERSTANDS!!!". How can something have an understanding of terms or even definitions with nothing to relate it to physically?

A program doesn't 'understand' it only reacts to variables based on predetermined responses. Even if your game AI choses a path through some buildings at random, to get to a target, it's still predetermined. There is code there that inables the representation of a character to "move" randomly. Random is part of a function.

So when is sentience possible?
1. let's make sure we're out of the confines of only a coded file.
2. let's embed whatever code we've written into something physical. Robotics come to mind, neh? (Catch that anyone ^.^?)E.G.

In order to be sentient, something needs to be able to precieve. without perceptions of reality, there's really nothing to truly experience, therefore no understanding. . . without understanding how is there intelligence.

Experience is the base of everything that we are. Experience is what urges us to act and react the way that we do, sorta like programming. Only these reactions wern't predetermined at birth. Were they? no.
Sure we make choices of whether or not to do something, but to even understand what that something is, we need reality experience. . . otherwise how would there be sentience.

We experience through action, and through our mental representation of an action(normally dependent one what we've heard or seen). So, a machine would need to be the same way.

Okay so we need something that can physically react with society. Robotics covers that. There are robots than can to an extent learn... memory and experience, check.

We don't have a readout/access to all of the happenings in our body. Sure there are some responses we get through feeling, but we don't calculate the information traveling through our minds until it gets to our conscious perception do we? With that said. . . robotics would need the same push in their programming to achieve true sentience.

A program needs to be semi cutoff from the base functions, which keep it going. There should be something in the program that receives input on a constant timescale, with no connection to the electronic support functions. This area of the program would need to project two images. Visuals, and the best representation of the mind's eye (aka thought). all processing known to this 'conscious' section of the program would be done within this mind's eye through a mixture of images, sounds, and how reactions are played out. Basically a three dimensional virtual reality would be built in order for the consciousness to perceive things as similar to us as possible.(this get's more complex, but it's difficult to explain)

Only a theory, but consciousness is possibly a check. That coupled with the ability for robotics to learn through visuals and reactions to their own physical action. Well that's so many steps closer to the goal of true intelligence through an artificial system.

And that is what we're talking about here 'intelligence through an artificial system'. That is the meaning that generally comes to thought(due to a process of retrieving emotions, sights, sounds, feelings related to the term artificial intelligence). Yes you could look at the term literally, but don't act like we do that with everything[ex. 'a lot...' it's casually used to refer to a large number of the subject. . . not an actual LOT of whatever.. yeh that's the root, but we're not thinking of it literally]

Conclusion. Yes, i believe artificial intelligence is possible, granted:
1. Program is embedded within a physical robotic machine
2. the sensory input is relayed to the 'conscious' part of the program
3. the conscious is connected to memory through will of recall and situational necessity/happenings
4. The consciousness is separated from the base electronic stabilizing functions
5. Through the consciousness has the ability to reason using the memories gathered purely through previous sensory input and actions.

The question from me now is... can a machine have will?

In order to bring things closer and closer to reality, the trick is not writing a function to handle a full action to represent something... it's separating each and every possible element of anything done in an organism and representing the most BASIC parts of each action to the most petite possible detail. So, this new list of extremely basic functions have to work together, yet separate in their own way, to present each and every action preformed by a machine.

At that point, we can only hope sentience is born.

Feb 6, 2008, 11:46 pm	#34 (permalink) (top)
harrythehorton Sedimentary Rock Posts: 7	clear things up, maybe? Artificial in this subject can be defined as: 1. made by human skill; produced by humans (opposed to natural): artificial flowers. 2. imitation; simulated; sham: artificial vanilla flavoring. Intelligence: 1. capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding, and similar forms of mental activity; aptitude in grasping truths, relationships, facts, meanings, etc. Rather than debating definitions, let's have them defined as they are generally understood with the subject. First off. Never say never. Don't say something could never be possible, because honestly, such an assumption will in many cases be proven wrong with time(granted it's somewhere near semi-understandable or conceptable bounds). Artificial Intelligence: a simulation of a capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding, and similar forms of mental activity(to combine definitions). Now with the literal definition of the terms. Yes, it's possible. It's being done now, there are too many examples that are meant to SIMulate intelligence. Though, that's not the definition people are normally referring to when talking about the future. So, the question is: are sentience, comprehension, reasoning, and a valid consciousness possible within the bounds of a machine? Many people have tried to write a program that reacts to user input(variables), who's responses are only based off the program's functions (predetermined, in a sense, responses... even if set to random[random what =)]). This is only a simulation. Then some programs were written which could connect, only mathematically, relationships between words and how they relate to each other saying "IT UNDERSTANDS!!!". How can something have an understanding of terms or even definitions with nothing to relate it to physically? A program doesn't 'understand' it only reacts to variables based on predetermined responses. Even if your game AI choses a path through some buildings at random, to get to a target, it's still predetermined. There is code there that inables the representation of a character to "move" randomly. Random is part of a function. So when is sentience possible? 1. let's make sure we're out of the confines of only a coded file. 2. let's embed whatever code we've written into something physical. Robotics come to mind, neh? (Catch that anyone ^.^?)E.G. In order to be sentient, something needs to be able to precieve. without perceptions of reality, there's really nothing to truly experience, therefore no understanding. . . without understanding how is there intelligence. Experience is the base of everything that we are. Experience is what urges us to act and react the way that we do, sorta like programming. Only these reactions wern't predetermined at birth. Were they? no. Sure we make choices of whether or not to do something, but to even understand what that something is, we need reality experience. . . otherwise how would there be sentience. We experience through action, and through our mental representation of an action(normally dependent one what we've heard or seen). So, a machine would need to be the same way. Okay so we need something that can physically react with society. Robotics covers that. There are robots than can to an extent learn... memory and experience, check. We don't have a readout/access to all of the happenings in our body. Sure there are some responses we get through feeling, but we don't calculate the information traveling through our minds until it gets to our conscious perception do we? With that said. . . robotics would need the same push in their programming to achieve true sentience. A program needs to be semi cutoff from the base functions, which keep it going. There should be something in the program that receives input on a constant timescale, with no connection to the electronic support functions. This area of the program would need to project two images. Visuals, and the best representation of the mind's eye (aka thought). all processing known to this 'conscious' section of the program would be done within this mind's eye through a mixture of images, sounds, and how reactions are played out. Basically a three dimensional virtual reality would be built in order for the consciousness to perceive things as similar to us as possible.(this get's more complex, but it's difficult to explain) Only a theory, but consciousness is possibly a check. That coupled with the ability for robotics to learn through visuals and reactions to their own physical action. Well that's so many steps closer to the goal of true intelligence through an artificial system. And that is what we're talking about here 'intelligence through an artificial system'. That is the meaning that generally comes to thought(due to a process of retrieving emotions, sights, sounds, feelings related to the term artificial intelligence). Yes you could look at the term literally, but don't act like we do that with everything[ex. 'a lot...' it's casually used to refer to a large number of the subject. . . not an actual LOT of whatever.. yeh that's the root, but we're not thinking of it literally] Conclusion. Yes, i believe artificial intelligence is possible, granted: 1. Program is embedded within a physical robotic machine 2. the sensory input is relayed to the 'conscious' part of the program 3. the conscious is connected to memory through will of recall and situational necessity/happenings 4. The consciousness is separated from the base electronic stabilizing functions 5. Through the consciousness has the ability to reason using the memories gathered purely through previous sensory input and actions. The question from me now is... can a machine have will? In order to bring things closer and closer to reality, the trick is not writing a function to handle a full action to represent something... it's separating each and every possible element of anything done in an organism and representing the most BASIC parts of each action to the most petite possible detail. So, this new list of extremely basic functions have to work together, yet separate in their own way, to present each and every action preformed by a machine. At that point, we can only hope sentience is born.