[BobbyO]

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QUOTE=lsbskins1;475626]It was not necessary to make Sadam more cooperative, it was necessary to insure he was not a true threat. We could have kept up in much the same way in Iraq,

By 2001 the consensus for the sanctions was eroding.

secured Afganistan more effectively and helped to create a real bastion of democracy in the region

Why would a far more primitive Afghanistan been a far more likely standard beaer of democracy in the region. heck, it isn't even in "the region." Its out in the boonies.

all with the support and good-will of the world community.

During the buildfup, the issue wasn't ust a question of whether the USA should go in. It was also a defense of the saddam regime. Why wuld that situation have been any better?

Once we had fought the real war against terror, we could have kept up a real coalition of the truely willing and used the power of our still present moral standing in the world to promote a Middle East peace plan that would have showed the average Arab citizen (who really only wants some kind of secure life and an expectation of future success) that the western world is not opposed to that happening.

But why would crushing Arab freedom fighers have shown the Arab world we were on their side?
And as an aside, why does the burden fall only on the west to show they are serious about a real settlement in the mid-east? Are the Arabs true innocents and bystanders in the problems in their own backyards?

All of our policies in the middle east are focused on securing our power and control.

So supporting governments which fight back against the local crazies are what? puppets of a mad American desire for control? Or an effort to marginalise the crazies?

there is a small radical branch of Islamic idiots who believe that the world will not be right until it has been returned to the state of being that existed when Mohhamed walked the earth. The way you defeat them is to marginalize them.

Sure, you demonstrate what a world under the Islamic idiots would be like.

You make life agreeable to the majority so that their idiotic rantings seem just what they are.

The problem here is that this involves a theological debate, and a theological debate within the realm of Islam. I am not so sure that the opinions of Christians will carry much weight.

And just like the KKK and the militia morons in the US will never completely go away, they get less support when the world around them does not lend creadence to their stupid ideals. If you are shooting at them every chance you get, they get to wag their fingers and scream from the mountains "Oppression!"

You are assuming that "fighting back" as opposed to "fighting for."

And in case you haven't seen it before, I will say it again. I lived in the DC area on 9/11. I worked 3 blocks from the Pentagon.

I lived across the Hudson in New Jersey on 911. Only me being late to work that day kept me from being on Chambers St when the first plane hit.

You would not care either (if it was one of your family) that we TRY not to kill innocents. Those people are just as innocent and just as dead as any American. We feed the monster when we do stupid shit like that

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The tactics of the "Islamic idiots" is to strap bombs on people and explode them in crowed markets. Do you think maybe THAT is the problem in Iraq? Do you think maybe those tactics have the effect of turning Iraqis away from its advocates? How come an unfortunate accident which kills some innocent creates a monster, but a deliberate response which kills innocents is okay?

Is Bin Laden weaker? Yes, but he does not care. He cares that millions more despise us now. Can HE attack us with the same effect? No, but he does not care. He cares that millions of more brains are being applied to finding ways to attack us and thousands of more cells with the same ideology are being spawned. It was a stupid, short sighted solution. It will cost us if we do not stop it. It has already cost us, just not in civilian blood, yet.

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I am quite sure Bin Laden would prefer to live in a palace than a cave... He cares that he is weaker.
And the evidence sseems to suggests that millions of little bin laden's are not being spawned. They are fleeing.