Quote:
Quote by: tivodan1116  Compare the cows to buffalo. In the case of buffalo, they were community property - no one was ultimately responsible for the herd, everyone just shot as many as they could (each according to his ability) and took home however many they wanted (each according to his need - or want as the case may be). Buffalo were overhunted to the point of near extinction until - guess what - private farmers realized there was money to be made from buffalo farms. More then the endangered species list, private capitalist ownership has brought the buffalo back. |
So, you are basing your own theory on how communism cannot work because people are selfish on the premise that because the people who went West and killed all the buffalo were rednecks and killed all the buffalo, 'cuz they wanted to?
I can immediately point to the history immediately preceding White Man coming onto the Plains, shall we go there?
Prior to Europeans settling the Americas, indigenous tribes lived off the land in communal states. On the Great and high plains of the American mid-west, roughly the modern named Mississippi River on the east to the Rocky Mountains on the west, due to the dry climate and relative lack of tall vegetation, as in trees to be used for housing, the tribes followed nomadic lifestyles. As such, the people learned the value of understanding the great buffalo and came to hold this beast in the highest regard. They used this animal's flesh for food, which they treated for the long winter season, and found ways to use every part of the animal so that none of its life, and death, would be in vain. Also, practically, the hide of the buffalo could be used for clothing and shelter, the fur for the same, the tribesmen did not want to take the animal's life but it was essential to living on the plains. The people lived in relative harmony with one another, and it has been difficult to ascertain whether a currency was used, or a standard method of trade.
So. Unless you disagree with anything I just said, which I imagine you will because you seem to disagree with everything I say, which is fine, I don't care, but unless you disagree with something FACTUAL that I have just stated, I assume I can go on to making my analysis?
.....
Ok, ah the joy of internet-communication. :)
It seems to me that communism was being practiced by these great tribes of native americans, and had been the case for quite a while. Then, however, European Americans came into the picture and destroyed that way of life, because they wanted to own all of the land between the two great oceans. They used currency, and had the notion that not only could land be owned, but animals and even other people as well. To nomadic tribes, this idea was completely confounding, it was just something nobody ever thought of before. Then, the Americans killed almost all of the great buffalo, for no reason, many they just left rotting. It was as if they hunted for sport. And now, the communist natives had no way to support their lifestyles anymore. And the Americans killed them, as well.
So, I have considered the history of this tragedy and have found that communism is more ideal to me than capitalism. It seems funny to me, having come to that conclusion, that you intended the opposite to occur. Thoughts?
----------
Actual Thread-at-hand response:
Also, I still stand by the way I divvied up my tax contribution. As to the amount, it is hard to say. Many things would need to change structurally in the U.S. before this could happen. But, I will allow myself to think that now the U.S. is not focused on continued expansion and cares about higher values. Because of this, I probably have a job that matches my skills and I probably make a pretty decent salary. Assuming that health-care is no longer a concern, because it has been socialized, I have more income available. Because, probably, our methods of farming have become more sustainable, food prices have gone down. Because, probably, less of my energy comes from expensive fossil fuels, the amount I budget for this has decreased. Probably, life in general costs alot less because our Institutions have shifted motivation slightly, after all, tax has become voluntary.
So, if this is the case in this hypothetical America, I would probably have about 35-40% of my income free. So, whatever is left after my budget, and my wants (since now I can actually spend money on those, since all my money doesn't go to gas and the doctor), and whatever I feel like saving (since probably my retirement prospects also look a little better, with that shifting of priority by the government), then the rest I'd give to taxes. Because I would have spent ALL of that on those things before, only now that same amount will actually provide for all of my needs. And I still have income left over. Where do I catch the plane to this Planet Theory?
...ohh, it's Canada? Hey, any Canadians want a roommate?