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Chandler Frank · Mar 5, 2007, 07:59 am

Chandler Frank

Quote:
And anything that is possible must exist, since the universe is infinite.
The main assumption you seem to rely on, and the main downfall of most of your arguments.
The universe is not likely infinite. For it to be infinite could cause a multitude of paradoxes, (given your comments on another thread on the fact that given infinity, anything and/or everything is possible) Infinity itself may be a paradox, in that being constrained to a world, (and I propose, universe) that is defined by finity, our perception cannot go beyond such constraints. Nor is it ultimately proveable, for to prove infinity from within the constraints of the finity which we live and, more importantly, experiment is theoretically impossible.

Quote:
order for you and your world to be imagined in the first place you and your environment must be physically possible on some level.
Not necessarily, for what imagination is based entirely on physical possibilities? Dreams, for example, at times take the memories, the desires and other things from the subconcious - concocting at times a 'physically' (based on the rules of our world - those that the mind knows it must conform to when awake) impossible vision and/or experience.

To take this slightly deeper (sorry I may have misunderstood your idea here, but bear with me)

This being the imagination basing it's existence upon the physical constraints of this world, an imagination somewhere must also base itself on some set of rules in order to imagine other rules.

Thus for an imagination to conceive anything at all in the first place it needs a concrete truth (that the mind itself takes as truth, not necesarily reality - but what is reality outside of your mind, for does not your mind tell you what that reality is?) to first base from in order to continue the imaginational construct - for example the mind must believe that the eyes show what is truly in front of you, what you 'see' in order to then conceive any 'vision' from there - thus you are constrained to the truth of vision, of a physical reality, of sight, smell, touch, sound.

All which could lie to you by themselves, but the apparent co-incidence of these 'senses' together points otherwise. (again your theory of infinity, and that given infinity, random chance turns to reality - this could happen, where these senses co-incide, though not physically (based on outside rules - which are not testable by the senses of man, because of this infinity of the universe and the random-becomes-reality theory))

What say you? I've gotta go so I'll finish my reply later...

Mar 5, 2007, 07:59 am	#6 (permalink) (top)
Chandler Frank Change Agent Posts: 60	Chandler Frank Quote: And anything that is possible must exist, since the universe is infinite. The main assumption you seem to rely on, and the main downfall of most of your arguments. The universe is not likely infinite. For it to be infinite could cause a multitude of paradoxes, (given your comments on another thread on the fact that given infinity, anything and/or everything is possible) Infinity itself may be a paradox, in that being constrained to a world, (and I propose, universe) that is defined by finity, our perception cannot go beyond such constraints. Nor is it ultimately proveable, for to prove infinity from within the constraints of the finity which we live and, more importantly, experiment is theoretically impossible. Quote: order for you and your world to be imagined in the first place you and your environment must be physically possible on some level. Not necessarily, for what imagination is based entirely on physical possibilities? Dreams, for example, at times take the memories, the desires and other things from the subconcious - concocting at times a 'physically' (based on the rules of our world - those that the mind knows it must conform to when awake) impossible vision and/or experience. To take this slightly deeper (sorry I may have misunderstood your idea here, but bear with me) This being the imagination basing it's existence upon the physical constraints of this world, an imagination somewhere must also base itself on some set of rules in order to imagine other rules. Thus for an imagination to conceive anything at all in the first place it needs a concrete truth (that the mind itself takes as truth, not necesarily reality - but what is reality outside of your mind, for does not your mind tell you what that reality is?) to first base from in order to continue the imaginational construct - for example the mind must believe that the eyes show what is truly in front of you, what you 'see' in order to then conceive any 'vision' from there - thus you are constrained to the truth of vision, of a physical reality, of sight, smell, touch, sound. All which could lie to you by themselves, but the apparent co-incidence of these 'senses' together points otherwise. (again your theory of infinity, and that given infinity, random chance turns to reality - this could happen, where these senses co-incide, though not physically (based on outside rules - which are not testable by the senses of man, because of this infinity of the universe and the random-becomes-reality theory)) What say you? I've gotta go so I'll finish my reply later...