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Impenitent · Mar 27, 2004, 04:06 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,)

It just so happens that I recently taught Oedipus Rex and Antigone to a class of college freshmen. Could you point to the "degrading women" part for me so that we can have a bit more lengthy conversation on it?
<hr size="1" /></blockquote>
sure, Antigone is a bitch who gets dissed by Creon... she tried to set herself up as the one who did the "right thing" by buring her brother... Creon slapped her down so Antigone took the extreme measure of hanging herself...
it isn't that strange...
<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,)

I get the feeling that you're brushing this conversation aside rather than engaging it, but I'll ask anyway that you provide some particular analogues within the Greek tradition (or other traditions) to gangsta rap culture so that I can see what sorts of similarities you have in mind. Remember, I'm a college English teacher--I need specific examples! <hr size="1" /></blockquote>
and as far as Rex goes, a parallel can be drawn with the giving up of the baby... prophesy aside, this happens all the time in the rap culture... absent daddies are everywhere...

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Impenitent,)
homosexual sex was taboo 20 years ago... but it is making a comeback... and it was perfectly normal in plato's day and in 40 years it will be back in the closet...<hr size="1" /></blockquote><blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,)

I would argue that the context in which sex happens matters; in Plato's day pedophilia was the accepted norm, not necessarily sex between adult men (I'm using primarily Plato's Symposium as my text, though I've read in historical surveys that this bears out in most cases). Every gay man I've talked to on this seems to think that something different is going on in the late twentieth and early twenty-first centuries. What sorts of historical developments do you have in mind driving certain sexual preferences "back in the closet," or are you simply assuming that all things are cyclical and that particular historical developments aren't all that relevant to all this?<hr size="1" /></blockquote> my point was that it is cyclical and the history bears this out...

Mar 27, 2004, 04:06 pm	#11 (permalink) (top)
Impenitent Hot Lava Posts: 1,859	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,) It just so happens that I recently taught Oedipus Rex and Antigone to a class of college freshmen. Could you point to the "degrading women" part for me so that we can have a bit more lengthy conversation on it? <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> sure, Antigone is a bitch who gets dissed by Creon... she tried to set herself up as the one who did the "right thing" by buring her brother... Creon slapped her down so Antigone took the extreme measure of hanging herself... it isn't that strange... </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,) I get the feeling that you're brushing this conversation aside rather than engaging it, but I'll ask anyway that you provide some particular analogues within the Greek tradition (or other traditions) to gangsta rap culture so that I can see what sorts of similarities you have in mind. Remember, I'm a college English teacher--I need specific examples! <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> and as far as Rex goes, a parallel can be drawn with the giving up of the baby... prophesy aside, this happens all the time in the rap culture... absent daddies are everywhere... </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Impenitent,) homosexual sex was taboo 20 years ago... but it is making a comeback... and it was perfectly normal in plato's day and in 40 years it will be back in the closet...<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'></span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Automatic Nate,) I would argue that the context in which sex happens matters; in Plato's day pedophilia was the accepted norm, not necessarily sex between adult men (I'm using primarily Plato's Symposium as my text, though I've read in historical surveys that this bears out in most cases). Every gay man I've talked to on this seems to think that something different is going on in the late twentieth and early twenty-first centuries. What sorts of historical developments do you have in mind driving certain sexual preferences "back in the closet," or are you simply assuming that all things are cyclical and that particular historical developments aren't all that relevant to all this?<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> my point was that it is cyclical and the history bears this out... "I really like this jacket, but the sleeves are much too long..." insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results...