[Starboy]

Quote by: Pale RIder I never said that we recognize teenagers as full grown adults...but they are human beings...it is you who has suggested that no one becomes a human being until he or she is able to reproduce...strike that, you said that we are not human beings until we HAVE reproduced...you most certainly are in a corner with that one and you simply are not going to be able to get out without first admitting how terribly wrong you are in such a silly assertion...children and adolescents not human...what a goofball...

Call me a goof ball if you like but the question was in the biological context of a species. It is a fact that successful reproduction is one of the requirements of a species. Now if you want to frame the question in a social context that is fine as well, but surely such an intelligent and well education person as yourself *cough* knows that over history and even today different societies have different standards as to when offspring are vested as humans. It is not as if it is set by nature in any definite way.

It isn't that I don't like your answer..hell, I laugh out loud at your answer...How about you give me a link to some credible source that says that one does not become human until one is able to reproduce...for that matter, how about a credible source stating that any creature is not a member of its species until it can reproduce...

There have been many notable cases of people that were dead yet still connected to life support. Their bodies were alive but they were dead. The point that apparently eludes you is that human live is an emergent phenomenon. It is not enough for all the cells in a body to be alive, they must also work together to create a living human being. A single cell doesn't qualify. Ten cells do not qualify. One million cells do not qualify, but there is a point during gestation when they do qualify. When if what is in the womb was removed from the womb it could survive as a baby. At that point it becomes it becomes human. And as we grow old and our cells slowly cease to work well together we also die, even though at the moment of the human death most of the cells in the body are still alive. The presence of living human cells doesn’t in and of it self constitute a living human being.

Brain Death

Brain Death

Death

Conversely it is also possible for the organism to die and for cells and organs to live and to be used for transplantation. In the latter case, though, the still-living tissues must be removed and transplanted quickly or they too will soon die without the support of their host. Rarely, cells can be immortal as in the case of Henrietta Lacks HeLa cell line.

Today, where a definition of the moment of death is required, we usually turn to "brain death" or "biological death": people are considered dead when the electrical activity in their brain ceases. It is presumed that a stoppage of electrical activity indicates the end of consciousness. However, those maintaining that only the neo-cortex of the brain is necessary for consciousness sometimes argue that only electrical activity there should be considered when defining death. In most places the more conservative definition of death (cessation of electrical activity in the whole brain, as opposed to just in the neo-cortex) has been adopted (for example the Uniform Definition of Death Act in the United States).

Note that in this definition most of the cells in a body could still be alive but the human is still considered to be dead.

The other thing to note is that many dead people are kept alive after they are dead long enough to harvest their organs. So most of their major organs are functioning but they are still dead. Again living human cells != living human.

Why don't you give an accurate description rather than trying to dance around the truth...the words you are looking for are brain dead...and again, one can not compare the condition of a human that is vital and growing to one who is injured and in the process of atrophy...in either case, growing, or dying both are human until body function ceases and a time of death is pronounced...

But that is my point. That what dies is the ability of the cells in the body to act as an animal organism. That living cells in and of themselves do not constitute a human. That human life is an emergent phenomenon.

Emergent Phenomenon

Emergent processes or behaviors can be seen in many places, from any multicellular biological organism to traffic patterns or organizational phenomena to computer simulations and cellular automata.

Note that in the medical jargon one is kept ALIVE by artificial means...not kept dead by artificial means..

Okay. So what?

Do you suppose that one just takes "bio chemistry" courses....is that your impression of higher education? Does it not occur to you that if one is to major in biochemistry that one must have a thourough education in both biology and chemistry...as well as math and physics? Maybe you should look up a generic cirriculum for biochemistry...

I am not a biochemist but know a few. They are more concerned with molecular biophysics than multicellular organisms. It is not as if they have the cell figured out.

And still I wait for you to enlighten me as to what species you belonged to before you became a human....you realize that people are reading this don't you...how silly you must look to them suggesting that their kids have not yet become human...that unless they have kids of their own that they are not yet human...again...goofball comes to mind...

At least I know how to count and at least I know the difference between a single cell and an animal organism. But we appear to be going around in circles. You want to play this word game. You want to say that an embryonic cell of any species is the same as an animal of that species. No one thinks an egg is a chicken. Except apparently you and you think I am silly. And yes you are right. Lots of people are reading this. Keep it up and there will be no doubt you are a moron.

Starboy