[jamesj]

Jamesj, science doesn't "prove" anything. It is a process for preferring one explanation over others. As for existence, that is an aspect of reality. We don't exactly know what reality is. That is what we are trying to figure out. And to claim that something existed forever sounds like an out and out lie. How do you know that something has existed forever when you seem to question if the existence of anything at all can be “proven”? And don't you have your wires crossed when you challenge science to "prove" anything when you haven't "proven" one of your claims?

The Judeao-Christian culture of Western civilization tends to deny the existence of Absolutely Nothing. This causes words, (reference points), that adequately describe the phenomena of absolutely nothing, not to be a part of the common vernacular. I will approach the idea of Nothing, in particular an Absolute Nothing being in existence; i.e. Absolutely Nothing existing as an entity. The Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary definition of the word nothing does not adequately describe this idea.

“Nagarjuna, the Buddhist teacher believed to have lived in India sometime around the late second century and the early third century, expounded the teaching of sunyata (Jpn ku), which is variously translated as non-substantiality, void or emptiness. He developed the concept of non-substantiality from Shakyamuni’s principle of dependent origination (Skt pratityasamutpada; Jpn engi). Nagarjuna asserted that since everything arises and continues to exist by virtue of its relationship with other phenomena (i.e., dependent origination), it has absolutely no fixed or independent substance of its own (i.e., non-substantiality). Viewed from this perspective, there is nothing that cannot be changed. Nothing exists entirely on its own, and no form is absolute and immutable. The universe, then, is full of new situations at every moment.”

From URL:http://www.sgi-usa.org/buddhism/buddhismtoday/bc006.htm

‘What is the origin of numbers? In what way do numbers exist? Have they always been present as 'Platonic' abstractions, or do they require a mind to bring them into existence? Can numbers exist in the absence of matter or things to count?” “The Kadampa school of Buddhist philosophy claims that all phenomena are ultimately empty of inherent existence and do not exist as things in themselves. All phenomena exist solely in dependence on other phenomena, which are themselves empty and dependently related to other phenomena and so on. No matter how deeply or far back we search, no phenomenon can ever be found which is fundamental or a 'thing-in-itself'. Neither the observer nor any observed phenomenon exist independently, but are inextricably intertwined. This viewpoint is known as dependent relationship.” “Buddhist philosophy claims that all things arise out of emptiness (Sanskrit sunyata or shunyata)” “Von Neumann [VON NEUMANN 1923] proposed that all numbers could be bootstrapped out of the empty set by the operations of the mind.”

From URL:http://home.btclick.com/scimah/emptyset.htm

I hope this helps clarify what I mean by absolutely nothing.

The following information can be either proved or disproved with the scientific methood. It is in reference to M theory, (strings).

Comparison of the Typical Viewpoint and the Viewpoint Where Absolutely Nothing Exists There are four Families (rather than 3 families), 22 constants (rather than 20), & 8 views of the 8 basic energies not 5 views of the 11 basic energies; etc., etc… The Basic Paradox’s existence & interactions create the 4 forces and 8 Energies. The 4 Forces, (realms of existence), each consist of a paradoxical duality. These forces combine with the duality to produce the 8 factors of life. These 4 forces & 8 factors create 8 fundamental vibrations, (8 Energies); 7 are easily perceived & 1 is not. The 8 factors combine with the 8 Energies to produce 16,777,216 dimensions (8 to the eighth power), (these dimensions exist simultaneously in the same space & time). We usually perceive a maximum of 4,096 of them; but, because of our human perspective we think there are approximately 3,000, (i.e. ichinen sanzen).

see Slide # 18 on URL:
http://7777777s.com/ppframe_files/frame.htm